How not to bench press 295lbs

[KIDRR]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cEcv0Yn8z_c

[cbrf3]

owww, that must of hurt..

[Gragorin]

That spotter really fucked up by removing his hands that far away from the bar, a very bad thing to do. You can actually see the guys chest cave in as the weight bounces off of it.. You know that had to hurt!

[Climber]

I disagree that it was the spotters fault.

The guy tried to bench press way more than he was capable of pressing, I challange anybody to try to claim that they would have done a better job than that spotter if they didn't know the guy was in way over his head.

It was a simple case of natural selection coming close to asserting itself.

[outlikeatrout]

Well, they don't call it a "suicide grip" for nothing...

[PASTAPWR]

Originally posted by outlikeatrout
Well, they don't call it a "suicide grip" for nothing...

Had to rewatch after reading your comment, but you are right on the money. The bar slips off the guys hands and right onto his chest.

[Sharky]

Why the hell would you grip the bar like that?
Darwin hello????

[Zerox]

Yikes, that guy never even had hold of the bar. Does he have thumbs?

[HtChic]

He didn't even slow it down - which means he was WAY over his limits! I've seen guys get in over their heads, but all the spotter had to do was help a little - generally they can handle the majority of the weight - that guy couldn't come close.

[Bad Dad]

It had nothing to do with his "ability", it had everything to do with his grip.


And if you're "maxing", then yes, the spotter should always have his hand under.


As far as his grip, I always bench that way. It prevents screwing up my thumbs.

[Bruce]

Yeoch

[lovekeiiy]

I don't bench with a grip like that. It wasn't comfortable to me and I did not feel I had enough control of the weight.

I have had some buddies who did bench that way. They felt they got a better lift or hit the muscle slightly differently. Ironically enough, the wieght slip and slammed into his chest too.

As to the spotter, it depends on how much those two guys have worked out with each other. If I'm spotting someone new or a wieght I know will be challenging for the person, my hands stay right below the bar the whole time. If I'm told it's not hard wieght or I know it's not, then I stand back and wait for it to become challenging before helping.

Also, a lot of people don't know how to spot anyway, so it could the spotter doesn't know what he's doing.

Given how quickly the wieght dropped, spotter or not, that guy would have been hurt either way.

[slackjaw]

Oh my God! That was HORRIBLE to watch!

As far as technique and blame go, well, it looked like an accident, pure and simple. The dude on the bench totally lost his grip and the bar fell. It was not a case of too much weight. A spotter can help you out and reduce the amount of REAL weight you are lifting, but what spotter could have stopped that?

I have used that grip for years now, and never had a problem. It's funny - I never even FELT as if I might drop the weight. I shifted my position because, when lifting heavy, wrapping my thumb around the bar did not feel right.

[zefflyn]

Like a train wreck.

[wannabe]

ouch...

[uhmeebuh]

Nothing to add here :laughing

Reverse grip is overrated and most people can't lift more that way. In fact, it tends to result in pec tears and shoulder injuries from the extra ROM. Skip it and learn how to bench properly.

Regardless, OUCH!

[MackeyStingray]

so what's the correct technique?

i'm starting to do freeweights again (light dumbells cause i'm a girly-man) but would like to know "proper" technique in benching properly

or is that something reserved for "consultation fee only" advice? :teeth

[SPZ510]

It was not the spotters fault, the guy just let the bar slip that's all. And with a true bench press you pick up the bar off the rack yourself. Only a pussy would need help lifting a wieght off the rack!

Mackey, the right tech is lift it off yourself, don't bounce it off your chest, and go all the way down. I've seen people do these little half benches that just kills me. If your in a competition you have to pause at the bottom. But for you just dont bounce it! Good luck!

[lovekeiiy]

I have competed in small competitions. In the bench, you do pause at the bottom, usually holding it lightly on your chest till given a signal to lift.

As to proper technique, hands about shoulder width apart, lower the wieght in a control manner to just above the chest (it is ok to touch), and lift in a straight and level manner. Bouncing off the chest is cheat using momentum, also can cause injury, also you don't work that first motion area. I prefer to wrap my thrumbs around the bar, a normal grip. Also, keep your feet flat on the ground, don't arch your back in the lift (it's a cheat because it the stronger part of the peck muscle, thus is why you can't do more in a decline lift than an incline).

You can hold the bar closer together or wider depending how you're trying to attack the muscle. If you don't have a spotter, I would suggest using dumbbells.

[uhmeebuh]

I don't want to start a whole other "fitness" thread but here it goes anyway...

Originally posted by SPZ510
It was not the spotters fault, the guy just let the bar slip that's all. And with a true bench press you pick up the bar off the rack yourself. Only a pussy would need help lifting a wieght off the rack!


Hmmm...I had no idea I was a pussy. :laughing

A "true bench"? What's that?

So, when you bench heavy (400lbs? 500lbs? More?) you do your own lift-offs? You do lift that much, right? Surely that's how you can make such a bold claim, right?

Shoulder "joints" are not a socket but rather more like a shallow bowl and therefore can't support much weight without the musculature. This is especially true in movements (like the bench) where your shoulder is in a posisiont where it's unsupported. So, please, save your name calling for some place else where you won't get called out on it.

A lift off can, and should, be used when benching heavy.

Originally posted by Smackey
so what's the correct technique?

i'm starting to do freeweights again (light dumbells cause i'm a girly-man) but would like to know "proper" technique in benching properly

or is that something reserved for "consultation fee only" advice?

The "correct" way is highly subjective and it really depends on your goals. I used to compete in powerlifting so I use a slightly different technique than bodybuilders. Gernally speaking, powerlifting techniques are easier on the joints simply beacuse they have to be since weavy weights + excessive joint strain = pain, inflamation, and injury.

Powerlifters want as much leverage as possible. So your hands move as far out on the bar as is allowed by the rules (pinky must be no farther out than the ring on olympic bars). Next you want to protect your shoulders and tuck your elbows rather than let them flair. This incorporates stronger muscle groups (lats, tris, and minimally, pecs) and helps protect the shoulder when lifting heavy. For competition, you'll need to pause on the chest just below your pec muscle on the sternum. This seems too low but with your elbows in the right place it actually reduces the length of the lift. During this your feet are to stay planted (no moving/squirming) and your shoulder blades retracted further reducing the length of the lift. Arching is allowed as long as your ass doesn't come off the bench. Combining all these things will seem unnatrual at first but it's given me (and a few hundred clients) a stronger bench press.

The same basic principle holds true for DBs - tuck the elbows, plant the feet, retract the scapulas, and push!

Originally posted by lovekeiiy
I have competed in small competitions. In the bench, you do pause at the bottom, usually holding it lightly on your chest till given a signal to lift.

Cool! Where did you compete? How was your total?

Originally posted by lovekeiiy
Also, keep your feet flat on the ground, don't arch your back in the lift (it's a cheat because it the stronger part of the peck muscle, thus is why you can't do more in a decline lift than an incline).


Close, but the goal is to lift more and, as long as you stay within the rules, you should do whatever allows you to safely make the lift.

Arching your back helps protect the spine during heavy benches and is not cheating in any federation I've ever lifted in (USAPL, APF, WABDL). It does provide better leverage than a flatter bench and is therefore desireable for lifters.

The common thinking is that the pecs actually do the lift but that's incorrect if your form is good (for powerlifting). The pec is merely a stabilizer in the bench press. Unless, of course, you are body building in which case all bets are off and the most muscle wins.

I don't know too many people that can lift *more* in the incline press than the decline press. I can lift ~100lbs more in the decline press...

[Thirdnalga]

I'm gonna 'roid up and go work out.

[SPZ510]

Originally posted by uhmeebuh
I don't want to start a whole other "fitness" thread but here it goes anyway...



Hmmm...I had no idea I was a pussy. :laughing

A "true bench"? What's that?

So, when you bench heavy (400lbs? 500lbs? More?) you do your own lift-offs? You do lift that much, right? Surely that's how you can make such a bold claim, right?



I had no idea that you were a pussy either, but somethimes you never know, I'll take your word for it. Personally I put up 275. That's it. Not setting any records but not anything to put your nose up at either. The opinion of the rack lift off came from my old work out partner who works out at 24hr fitness in Pleasant Hill and puts up 435 on a regular basis. He's the one who told me that about getting help off the rack. He trained me so I listened. He also puts up more than anyone at that gym, so I doubt that anyone there can argue. Too bad you had to take that statement so personally. I did'nt mean to hurt anyones feelings. If it makes you feel any better, the first time I really said anything to my training buddy, he was walking by and I called him a FAG! He started cracking up, we've been friends ever since. Good luck at the gym and watch that rotator cup!:teeth

[thendougsaid]

i think a suicide grip is suggested when doing decline bench...

[uhmeebuh]

Originally posted by SPZ510
I had no idea that you were a pussy either, but somethimes you never know, I'll take your word for it. Personally I put up 275. That's it. Not setting any records but not anything to put your nose up at either. The opinion of the rack lift off came from my old work out partner who works out at 24hr fitness in Pleasant Hill and puts up 435 on a regular basis. He's the one who told me that about getting help off the rack. He trained me so I listened. He also puts up more than anyone at that gym, so I doubt that anyone there can argue. Too bad you had to take that statement so personally. I did'nt mean to hurt anyones feelings. If it makes you feel any better, the first time I really said anything to my training buddy, he was walking by and I called him a FAG! He started cracking up, we've been friends ever since. Good luck at the gym and watch that rotator cup!:teeth

I don't understand why people talk about shit they have no experience with or knowledge about. Please go to a powerlifting meet, or get industry certifications, or go to school for a sports science degree, or have powerlifting experience, or train a few hundred clients before you say anything about lifting.

So, what makes you qualified to offer lifting advice? You still haven't answered what a "true bench" is...

Hopefully you realize that your kind of ignorant advice can have disastrous results for new lifters and THAT'S why I take this so seriously. I used to have to fix broken athletes after they listened to advice like yours. Some of them never recover fully.

You should know better than to make sweeping generalizations. Most adults do, but then again, I don't call friends "a FAG".

And it's rotator cuff, not cup. :rolleyes

[therok229]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YIjKrUaryCA&mode=related&search=


This looks like it hurt too

[SPZ510]

See the thing is, this is an open forum. Meaning anyone can say anything they like as long as it is within the rules of the forum. So your going to have an enviroment filled with "stories", opinion and general bullshit. It's your perogative weather or not to believe what you hear here. And if you listen to what is said on this forum and go out and hurt yourself because of it then that is only the fault of the recipient of the info that was given. It's a part of natural selection.
If your a trainer, and one of your clients has hurt themselves because they listened to advise given without proven credentials. You have to take some of the resposibility yourself for not advising your clients to check with you before they use the advise in question.
Are you saying that people you know have permenately injured themselves because the did not get a lift-off? I doubt it. I could be wrong, but I doubt it.
"True Bench"? Really I only have an idea in my head of what a true bench is but I would'nt stake my life on it. But I will tell you one thing. I said that your "supposed to" pause at the bottom and another member of this forum agreed, as he had competed in a small competion himself. So obviously everything I say is'nt just bullshit. Not saying its right but there are others out there taht feel the same way. So maybe my lift-off advise is correct after all.
Yeah, I talk shit to my people. See I live in a world where people have confidence in themselves and thier sexuallity. Joking around with them about it does'nt offend them or give them the feeling that they are in question. Take it from me it's a nice thing to have. It gives you the strength to ignore self doubt while having to keep your wits about you.
I really hope you don't take too many more of these threads or post so seriously. Really there is no reason to get so upset by what you find here.
With ALL that being said, have a good and safe Labor Day.

Cuff, cup.....whatever. You think I can hear what anyone says in the gym when my ears are ringing so bad. Im suprised I got it that close.
:laughing

[uhmeebuh]

Originally posted by SPZ510
See the thing is, this is an open forum. Meaning anyone can say anything they like as long as it is within the rules of the forum. So your going to have an enviroment filled with "stories", opinion and general bullshit. It's your perogative weather or not to believe what you hear here. And if you listen to what is said on this forum and go out and hurt yourself because of it then that is only the fault of the recipient of the info that was given. It's a part of natural selection.
If your a trainer, and one of your clients has hurt themselves because they listened to advise given without proven credentials. You have to take some of the resposibility yourself for not advising your clients to check with you before they use the advise in question.
Are you saying that people you know have permenately injured themselves because the did not get a lift-off? I doubt it. I could be wrong, but I doubt it.
"True Bench"? Really I only have an idea in my head of what a true bench is but I would'nt stake my life on it. But I will tell you one thing. I said that your "supposed to" pause at the bottom and another member of this forum agreed, as he had competed in a small competion himself. So obviously everything I say is'nt just bullshit. Not saying its right but there are others out there taht feel the same way. So maybe my lift-off advise is correct after all.
Yeah, I talk shit to my people. See I live in a world where people have confidence in themselves and thier sexuallity. Joking around with them about it does'nt offend them or give them the feeling that they are in question. Take it from me it's a nice thing to have. It gives you the strength to ignore self doubt while having to keep your wits about you.
I really hope you don't take too many more of these threads or post so seriously. Really there is no reason to get so upset by what you find here.
With ALL that being said, have a good and safe Labor Day.


So, lets see here:

You don't have a background in powerlifting, or industry certifications, or a degree in sports science, or experience as a trainer BUT you feel you can give advice because of some guy you met at a gym? :laughing

Then you give advice about a trainers' responsibility after you demonstrate your lack of knowledge about basic anatomy?? :laughing

Please, do us all a favor and save the lifting advice to people who have the experience...

[MackeyStingray]

btw, thanks for editing my name :twofinger

i'm not going to do any competition, just wanna get yoked up y0! and not hurt myself in the process doing the wrong technique.

[Bad Dad]

easy brandon, maybe his dad is an engineer or somethin'.

[uhmeebuh]

Originally posted by M8!!1!
btw, thanks for editing my name

i'm not going to do any competition, just wanna get yoked up y0! and not hurt myself in the process doing the wrong technique.

Let me know if you have any questions...happy to show you if you have the time...

Originally posted by Bad Dad
easy brandon, maybe his dad is an engineer or somethin'.

Sorry - it's the triumples...errr...roids!

*Rarrgh!*

:laughing

[KIDRR]

Hey this one guy at the gym told me that if I keep a set of light weights by the side of my desk at work and do curls every hour I'll get mad swoll. Is this true???
























:rolleyes :hand :p

[SPZ510]

Originally posted by uhmeebuh
So, lets see here:

You don't have a background in powerlifting, or industry certifications, or a degree in sports science, or experience as a trainer BUT you feel you can give advice because of some guy you met at a gym? :laughing

Then you give advice about a trainers' responsibility after you demonstrate your lack of knowledge about basic anatomy?? :laughing

Please, do us all a favor and save the lifting advice to people who have the experience...

You know what? I do feel that I have experience in "weight"lifting, I've been doing it for 12 years, have had at least 3 different trainers in that time and have never had any serious injuries. So yeah I think I did pretty good and if some one ask me how I did it I will tell them. I don't feel that the original 295 lift could really be considered Powerlifting, regardless of how you are going to feel in your next post. I really could'nt care less. Where are your creditials anyways? I never faked like I had any and you speak like you have it all so show and prove. At first when you said that there might be problems from someone giving bad advise that might lead to one of your clients becoming injured, I actually cared. Not any more. I would be glad to hear of more corrections that you have to make instead of basic training showing improvement. This thead has really pissed me of because it's not someone saying, "Hey your wrong and you need to be carefull saying those things." This thead went round and round with you saying the same damn thing 3 times. "You have no credentials you should'nt be giving advise". That's basically all you said. Does it ever end? Really I could care less if you think I should be giving advise or not. Postiing B.S., opinions, and stories amongst other members is what I'm here for. :laughing :laughing :laughing
Talk to ya soon!:teeth

[slackjaw]

Originally posted by SPZ510
I could care less if you think I should be giving advise or not. Postiing B.S., opinions, and stories amongst other members is what I'm here for.

That is all well and good, but *I* am glad to know that I should ignore your advice in the area of weight lifting, or at least, power lifting. You are welcome to take your own advice (despite all of the evidence that doing so is a bad idea), but thanks to Uhmeebuh, BARF is now informed enough to read your "lifting" posts with a fair level of incredulity.

I am not sure if you are aware of this, but what you have been writing is tantamount to medical advice, and while opinion plays a role, such information is generally accepted to be more than merely ones opinion.

I may think that new R6 looks better or worse than the new R1, and that would be an opinion.

On the other hand, if I say that a stock 2006 R6 makes more horsepower than a stock 2006 R1, that's not an opinion - that's just incorrect.

Much like your advice.

And it is potentially dangerous to toss around advice such as that, while giving the impression that you know whereof you speak. You are welcome to share your own experiences in regards to weightlifting and training, but be sure to indicate that you are NOT a trainer, and your experience is just that, YOUR experience. You may have seen the abreviation - YMMV?

If you look around, you will see others here doing the same. Not always, but mostly. And when they don't, they are quickly called out and shown to be full of B.S., as you were here.

It's the circle of life. :laughing

[SPZ510]

Originally posted by slackjaw
That is all well and good, but *I* am glad to know that I should ignore your advice in the area of weight lifting, or at least, power lifting. You are welcome to take your own advice (despite all of the evidence that doing so is a bad idea), but thanks to Uhmeebuh, BARF is now informed enough to read your "lifting" posts with a fair level of incredulity.

I am not sure if you are aware of this, but what you have been writing is tantamount to medical advice, and while opinion plays a role, such information is generally accepted to be more than merely ones opinion.

I may think that new R6 looks better or worse than the new R1, and that would be an opinion.

On the other hand, if I say that a stock 2006 R6 makes more horsepower than a stock 2006 R1, that's not an opinion - that's just incorrect.

Much like your advice.

And it is potentially dangerous to toss around advice such as that, while giving the impression that you know whereof you speak. You are welcome to share your own experiences in regards to weightlifting and training, but be sure to indicate that you are NOT a trainer, and your experience is just that, YOUR experience. You may have seen the abreviation - YMMV?

If you look around, you will see others here doing the same. Not always, but mostly. And when they don't, they are quickly called out and shown to be full of B.S., as you were here.

It's the circle of life. :laughing

Exactly! I should have stated that it was in my own experience. And I do appologize for that. But B.S.? No. No one has made an attempt to show any correction to my advise and has given reason to believe that my advise was incorrect in the first place. The only facts that have been brought about is that my advice comes from my own experiences and not an education in that field. So unless someone has better advise then the only B.S. is that there is no other advise. Just talk!
My advise was that you should'nt need a lift-off to do a bench? Prove me wrong! Educate me, instead of just saying that I don't have room to talk. Tell me why?????

[slackjaw]

Originally posted by SPZ510
Exactly! I should have stated that it was in my own experience. And I do appologize for that. But B.S.? No. No one has made an attempt to show any correction to my advise and has given reason to believe that my advise was incorrect in the first place. The only facts that have been brought about is that my advice comes from my own experiences and not an education in that field. So unless someone has better advise then the only B.S. is that there is no other advise. Just talk!
My advise was that you should'nt need a lift-off to do a bench? Prove me wrong! Educate me, instead of just saying that I don't have room to talk. Tell me why?????

I think that was the point of one of Uhmeebuh's earlier posts (though I hesitate to put words in his mouth). He made note of the physiology of the shoulder and that it is really a "shallow bowl", and particularly that it is easy to injure your shoulder when the supporting musculature is not properly engaged - say, like, when lifting off of the rack.

Also, numerous other sources note that having a lift-off saves energy for the reps and helps to ensure that you get to a proper starting position.

But again, this is just what I have heard and read - I am not a trainer.

Regardless, a statement such as yours, "Only a pussy would need help lifting a wieght off the rack!" is pretty clearly B.S. - don't you think?

[SPZ510]

Originally posted by slackjaw
Regardless, a statement such as yours, "Only a pussy would need help lifting a wieght off the rack!" is pretty clearly B.S. - don't you think?

I agree. But it was'nt meant to really iritate anyone just having a little fun. Like I mentioned earlier, me and my friends have pretty tough skin so I would'nt think that anyone would take that to heart.
I will tread a little more gently next time so I don't offend anyone.
And thanks for addressing my questions instead of just repeating what has allready been said.

[slackjaw]

Originally posted by SPZ510
I agree. But it was'nt meant to really iritate anyone just having a little fun. Like I mentioned earlier, me and my friends have pretty tough skin so I would'nt think that anyone would take that to heart.
I will tread a little more gently next time so I don't offend anyone.
And thanks for addressing my questions instead of just repeating what has allready been said.

"You are a dirty little fun haver..." :laughing

Nah, I wouldn't worry so much about offending anyone. After all, this IS the internet. We are all much tougher, bolder, and courageous over the web! Hell, I have received thinly veiled threats here, and I think I am fairly reasonable in my posting. Go figure!

I suspect that Uhmeebuh reacted strongly because so many people manage to hurt themselves needlessly by lifting weights with no info or, even worse, the wrong info. I know that I have managed to injure myself through ignorance.

But, as you say, your approach has worked for you and your friends, and we know that one size does NOT fit all, so more power to ya.

[SPZ510]

Thanks, I appreciate that.:teeth

[fUxAsAUrUs]

umm.. regular bench press is your hands as far out enough to hit the most weight u can

hands shoulder width is close grip bench to hit ur tri's more..


but this is for working out, powerlifting competition wise i dunno

[uhmeebuh]

Originally posted by SPZ510
You know what? I do feel that I have experience in "weight"lifting, I've been doing it for 12 years, have had at least 3 different trainers in that time and have never had any serious injuries. So yeah I think I did pretty good and if some one ask me how I did it I will tell them. I don't feel that the original 295 lift could really be considered Powerlifting, regardless of how you are going to feel in your next post. I really could'nt care less. Where are your creditials anyways? I never faked like I had any and you speak like you have it all so show and prove. At first when you said that there might be problems from someone giving bad advise that might lead to one of your clients becoming injured, I actually cared. Not any more. I would be glad to hear of more corrections that you have to make instead of basic training showing improvement. This thead has really pissed me of because it's not someone saying, "Hey your wrong and you need to be carefull saying those things." This thead went round and round with you saying the same damn thing 3 times. "You have no credentials you should'nt be giving advise". That's basically all you said. Does it ever end? Really I could care less if you think I should be giving advise or not.

I thought I was saying, "Hey your wrong and you need to be carefull saying those things."

FWIW:
- BS in Sports Science
- Certifcations: CSCS, NASM, ISSA, and ACE
- 6 years of competitive powerlifting USAPL, APF, and WABDL - 3rd in CA '02-04 APF, DL was 40th in US '04 APF
- Hundreds of clients including professional athletes
- Best Bench in competition - 505 @242
- Best Squat in competition - 715 @242
- Best DL in competition - 705 @242

Originally posted by SPZ510
My advise was that you should'nt need a lift-off to do a bench? Prove me wrong! Educate me, instead of just saying that I don't have room to talk. Tell me why?????

I mentioned this before but the shoulder and supporting musculature can not handle much weight in that overhead position without risking injury. The weight falls on smaller, weaker muscles (rotator cuff, teres minor, infraspinatus, etc) that can't handle large shearing forces when lifting off. As a result, the weight rests on the tendons and ligaments in the shoulder (AC joint, ) responsible for holding the humerus into the shoulder "socket" (which isn't really a socket at all). The result can be injury due to too much stress on the muscles or tendons/ligaments.

Look at this image of the shoulder joint:
http://www.upperlimbcentre.com/images/bones.jpg

You can see the shallowness of the socket and how the acromium joint and shoulder girdle would be stressed as your humerus moves overhead.

This generally doesn't happen in lighter benches but as you get stronger it can become a serious concern. New lifters should be especially carfeul since they don't necessarily have the development to support even light benches.

Something to consider - why would some of the strongest guys in the world use a lift off if it was "only for pussys"?

Originally posted by SPZ510
Postiing B.S., opinions, and stories amongst other members is what I'm here for.

Now we know...

I'm done here - no sense in trying to change your mind. Best of luck with your lifting.

[SPZ510]

:cool

[Gragorin]

Originally posted by uhmeebuh
...- Best Bench in competition - 505 @242
- Best Squat in competition - 715 @242
- Best DL in competition - 705 @242
...

Those are some nice numbers, the best I ever got to was a 375 pound bench when I was about 265 pounds and 18 years old. I wasn't a power lifter though, I just lifted for football.