rider etiquette when being pulled over

[speedydave]

I searched for this but wasn't able to find anything along the lines of what I'm asking, so..

I'm getting my first bike very soon, so while I've been pulled over in my car (once, thankfully) and know some of the basics cops usually like to see (car off, keys on the dash, hands on the wheel, dome light on at night), I have no idea about what I should do to put the cop at ease should I get pulled over on my bike. I have no intention of running, ever, and I want to be able to convey that to whoever pulls me over, too.

Gloves/helmet: keep 'em on or take 'em off (obviously at least open the face shield)?

Engine: obviously shutting the bike off would be a good idea

Body language: stay on the bike? What should I do with my hands?

[lewdog]

Ummm...pull over and bust the BARF salute?

[ScottRNelson]

I've always turned the bike off with the key and taken off my gloves and helmet right away. If it takes very long for the LEO to come talk to me, I'll usually get off of the bike and sit on it sideways with my feet on the left (sidestand) side of the bike.

But it's been a few years since I've been pulled over, so my memory isn't exactly fresh. The bottom line is that I make it clear that I'm not going anywhere.

[MackeyStingray]

i haven't been pulled over too many times on a bike but i've always just shut the bike down, kickstand down, kept me hands on my hips or on the tank and waited for them to approach to give me further instructions.

anything that'll convey you're not threatening or have the intention of bolting

[motorman4life]

All good advice.

Pull to a safe place, cut the engine, put down kickstand, put your feet (or foot) on the ground and relax. Wait for the walk up and further instructions. You will likely be asked to remove your helmet and produce license, registration and proof of insurance. You may be asked to remove the key. Follow the commands and stay mellow. Don't get off the bike until asked to do so, or if you need to in order to comply with instructions. As a rule, if you feel you need to get off to get paperwork under the seat or in a saddlebag, inform the officer and wait for a nod. Don't just jump off and start into bags or your leathers hoping for the best.

Stay mellow, don't be confrontational. Ask questions and don't keep pushing or arguing if you don't like the answer. If you feel the officer is wrong, take it to court. Make an ass of yourself and s/he will make ironclad notes to prepare for the court case.

Ideally, you want the stop to go quickly and you want to be forgotten. If a ticket is written, you want as many breaks as possible and as little notetaking done as possible. This means you need to keep pretty quiet and just go with the flow. Saying things like "haven't you ever made a mistake?" or "you only stopped me because I'm _______" will not help anyting and will not get you the walk you likely believe you so richly deserve.

If you fucked up and are sorry and it is clear a ticket will be written, be a man and say, "I fucked up and I'm truly sorry officer." If you don't know which way it will go, you might just want to keep your mouth shut.

If the officer asks you questions (do you know why I stopped you? do you know how fast you were going? do you know what the speed limit is here?), don't lie. A good response is, "I'm sure you would not have stopped me for no reason, obviously you felt it was important to talk to me."

Make eye contact and stay cool. Put on your "I'm your buddy" face and don't get upset if you still get to give an autograph. Expect a cold response and don't let it phase you. Remember, you are trying to be forgotten. Let things wrap up quickly and move on. Take the lesson and figure out whether it is worth trying to fight the ticket afterwards.

[SpeedyCorky]

Originally posted by motorman4life

Stay mellow, don't be confrontational. Ask questions and don't keep pushing or arguing if you don't like the answer. If you feel the officer is wrong, take it to court. Make an ass of yourself and s/he will make ironclad notes to prepare for the court case.

Ideally, you want the stop to go quickly and you want to be forgotten. If a ticket is written, you want as many breaks as possible and as little notetaking done as possible.

If you fucked up and are sorry and it is clear a ticket will be written, be a man and say, "I fucked up and I'm truly sorry officer." If you don't know which way it will go, you might just want to keep your mouth shut.

"I'm sure you would not have stopped me for no reason, obviously you felt it was important to talk to me."



excelent advice. :thumbup
above it was posted that you might wanna get off the bike. i personally recoomend highly against stepping off the saddle.

due to my last interaction with the CHP, i'm gonna have to say the best things to do is pull over quicky w/o braking too hard cuz u dont want the LEO to have to brake hard and spill their coffee..once pulled over in as safe of a place as you can find, take off helmet, gloves; put gloves in helmet and helmet on ground in a safe and slow manner. once you are sure the officer can see your actions, take out your ignition key and really obvious-like w/o being rude, drop your keys on the ground deliberatly. lets the LEO know you arnt going anywhere and runing away is the last thing on your mind.

cop approaches, you are now a person cuz you dont have your helmet anymore, rather than your previous identity of "speeding motorcyclist." remain calm, respectful. as MM4L said, anything you say should be short, and contain a whole lot of that calm and respectfullness as possible. saying the 2 phrases posted above sound like excelent advice to me, and in an ideal situation, will be ALL that you say

[silverbelt]

Excellent advice MM4L. Thanks for the reminder of how to act if you get stopped :thumbup

Personally, I don't ask questions and keep quiet unless I'm questioned by the officer. Having all your paperwork in order and having a calm demeanor is most effective to get back on your way.

When I do get pulled over, I always know why (speeding), so I just take the ticket as the cost of doing business. It is only a fraction of the time that I am actually caught.

Due to excessive speeding, I don't get let off with warnings very often, but sometimes luck is on my side.

[whezzy]

......

[whezzy]

i've been pulled over recently a few times by chp for minor infractions. i was new to the whole "pulled over on-a-bike" thing too but found that if you have a calm demeanor and act respectfully, you still might get a tix but the leo wont kick you in the shins. i also find it respectful to take off your helmet when speaking. MM4L - good advice....ima steal the info.

[SoarAndEnvision]

I would just add to this :

If you fucked up and are sorry and it is clear a ticket will be written, be a man and say, "I fucked up and I'm truly sorry officer." If you don't know which way it will go, you might just want to keep your mouth shut.

...that if you have any intention whatsoever of going to court make absolutely no admission of guilt or remorse whatsoever.

A big strategy to use in the court room is to basically look like there is no case and no reason believe the officer's recollection from his 2 month old notes is enough.

If he writes "he said , quote, I fucked up and I'm sorry." - you're going nowhere and you dry cleaned your suit for no reason.

Just my $.02 from fighting and winning tickets.

[motorman4life]

I'm just one guy, but I have let people go when they seemed genuine. Of the few that have been honest and up front, and seemed sincerely remorseful, I have cut many of them a break, from a verbal warning to a much reduced ticket. I've written guys for "40+" in a 35 zone when I had them dead-to-rights at over 70.

A lot of cops are used to being lied to all day, every day. Sometimes a fresh breath of honesty goes a long way. YMMV.

[Junkie]

so if you are riding with a passenger on the back, is there anything special you should do?

[mnb]

I would strongly advise against removing helmet or gloves or getting off the bike when you pull over.

The reason for this is that this is the most dangerous point of the stop for the officer. This is the point in time where officers have no idea if you're packing. They don't quite have you fully observed or under control.

Let the officer control the stop.

Pull over, shut off the bike. Flip up your visor and wait. He'll ask you to remove stuff most likely so he can see if your eyes are bloodshot. But let him ask.

If you pull over and go into a flurry of activity, it could be mistaken that you're trying to hide something or go for a weapon. You really don't want to risk giving the wrong impression.

Even if the cop doesn't freak, you've just pumped his adrenaline and the odds of a warning just shot down drastically.

If you have a passenger, they should remain on the bike and wait for the cop to request they de-helmet or dismount.

Be calm, non-confrontational and polite. Do NOT, repeat, do NOT taunt Happy Fun Ball!




Disclaimer: Not a LEO, but my Mom was for 28 years. Learned much via osmosis.

[Kelvrick]

Interesting. I was always of mind to take off my gloves and helmet to show I won' be leaving any time soon, but after reading all these, I tink I'm going to just shut the engine and leave my hands on the handlebars.

[ScottRNelson]

Originally posted by Kelvrick
Interesting. I was always of mind to take off my gloves and helmet to show I won' be leaving any time soon, but after reading all these, I tink I'm going to just shut the engine and leave my hands on the handlebars.
If I ever get pulled over on a bike again, I'll still remove my gloves and helmet right away. I figure it's to my advantage to let them know that they're dealing with a "more mature" rider. My license plate is the first step in that process, since it says "GRAMMPA".

There should be a few advantages to getting older. http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c67/scottrnelson/SM/oldguy.gif

[Nutshell]

i have been pulled over a few times, and havent gotten a ticket in about 5 years. every time i have been pulled over i did what everyone i know in arizona has done, but apparently it is not to common a practice here in ca. out there alot of people on bikes will run. so to put the officers at ease you slowly pull over, no drastic moves, pull out the key, hold your right hand fully extended out, and drop the keys on the ground. then put your hands back on the handlebars with the kickstand down and your feet on the ground.

Be honest but dont necessarily admit guilt if you arent painted into a corner, and be polite.

this has kept me ticket free for a few years now... and the few times i have been pulled over it was not that unpleasant an experience. the leo's seem appreciative of your courtesy and are much more likely to let you off with a warning.

[strnge]

Originally posted by ScottRNelson
I'll usually get off of the bike and sit on it sideways with my feet on the left (sidestand) side of the bike.



If I was to pull you over and you sat like that, I would take you as a "cocky" person. That would start the whole thing off wrong for you if you want to get out of the ticket.

I prefer riders to, and have done myself:

Pull over to the RIGHT, not the left like some idiots have, make a slow and deliberate stop. "Usually I will be calling in my location and that I am performing a stop." By the time dispatch answers me, you have come to a complete stop. I can now see your plate even more clearly than before. I run your plate now. You should be putting the kick stand down, turning the bike off, removing your gloves, and taking off your helmet. Hang the helmet on the mirror.

All of these signs are signs of respect. I am looking to see your body language as well as your face. This puts a real person behind the helmet instead of a "masked man." I am more likely to treat you better if you treat me with respect. This means your possibility of a warning has gone up greatly.

[trekuk]

Originally posted by strnge
I am looking to see your body language as well as your face.

Seems to me you want the biker to remain on the bike with his back towards you? Other wise the biker would be standing like a quizical dork somewhere or assuming a "cocky" position.. :confused

I'm certainly not going to throw away my keys or put on some theater of gestures to reasure the cop without instructed to do so. Pulling me over is one thing, assuming I'm mind-reading mime artist is quite another. Surely we can handle this like sensible adults both possessing the gift of communication, if the cop doesn't like my stance, digging through my pockets etc, he will have to let me know. This is hardly unreasonable since only one of us knows much about traffic stops. I assume the cop will not hold such minor stuff against me in terms of citations, especially when it's clearly innocent and quickly corrected.

ps! who unbends the license plate so it's readable? the cop or the rider? :laughing

[strnge]

His back should be facing me and his helmet should be off, so when I approach, I can see his face when I arrive.

As for removing the keys and droping the keys on the ground, that triggers instinct/muscle memory reactions. The only time anyone drops thier keys on the ground is a FELONY stop. I automaticlly would go into that mind set. No normal person takes thier keys out and throws them on the ground. Only people who know their SCREWED do that. It wouldnot help thier case in trying to get out of the ticket. You want to start out at 0 not -1 when your trying to get ahead right?

[Nutshell]

Originally posted by strnge
As for removing the keys and droping the keys on the ground, that triggers instinct/muscle memory reactions. The only time anyone drops thier keys on the ground is a FELONY stop. I automaticlly would go into that mind set. No normal person takes thier keys out and throws them on the ground. Only people who know their SCREWED do that. It wouldnot help thier case in trying to get out of the ticket. You want to start out at 0 not -1 when your trying to get ahead right?

Well that is good to know... like i said, in arizona, that is how they wanted it because so many asshat squids run out there... college kids who's parents bought them a R1 for their first bike who think they are invincible. if that is not how they want it out here, i should re-think my method.

not that i really have that problem of getting pulled over anyway. i have only been pulled over 3 times in 5 years. 1 ticket my first year of riding for 35 in a 25... im a good boy:angel

[Junkie]

what do you think of putting the key in the gas tank?

[masameet]

Any LEOs ever stop a rider (or cager) who refused to speak and so stayed silent throughout the stop?

A friend told me that we as citizens don't have to say anything when we're stopped. (What don't you understand about the Fifth Amendment and our right not to self-incriminate ourselves? was his reasoning.) Just wondering if this has ever happened to a LEO and whether it makes a LEO pissed off enough to look for more things to cite.

[Junkie]

um, of course it's going to piss them off and pissing them off is never a good thing.

[masameet]

I imagine a dumb cop would be more inclined to lose his cool, get mad and be abusive. A smart cop wouldn't react so negatively.

Still I'm wondering if any LEOs have encountered or know of other LEOs who've dealt with uncommunicative citizens that they've stopped. And how they handled the situation.

[JPM]

Originally posted by masameet
Any LEOs ever stop a rider (or cager) who refused to speak and so stayed silent throughout the stop?

A friend told me that we as citizens don't have to say anything when we're stopped. (What don't you understand about the Fifth Amendment and our right not to self-incriminate ourselves? was his reasoning.) Just wondering if this has ever happened to a LEO and whether it makes a LEO pissed off enough to look for more things to cite.

I had some say very little (Or way too much than I wanted them to) but it really doesn’t matter. They don't have to speak to sign a citation.

[cheezy]

Originally posted by SpeedyCorky
...is pull over quicky w/o braking too hard cuz u dont want the LEO to have to brake hard and spill their coffee..

Too funny dude.

[Hoologan]

Originally posted by strnge
As for removing the keys and droping the keys on the ground, that triggers instinct/muscle memory reactions. The only time anyone drops thier keys on the ground is a FELONY stop. I automaticlly would go into that mind set. No normal person takes thier keys out and throws them on the ground. Only people who know their SCREWED do that. It wouldnot help thier case in trying to get out of the ticket. You want to start out at 0 not -1 when your trying to get ahead right?

Exactly what I was thinking. It'll be a cold day in hell when I voluntarily throw my key on the ground unless specifically asked to do so.

[strnge]

Originally posted by Junkie
what do you think of putting the key in the gas tank?


I think that would be good!

[Mike T]

when i got pulled over by the CHP, i already shut off the engine and took off my lid and gloves. he then asked me to take out the key and throw it on the ground...then right after he asked for my papers and stuff :p ahaha i had to ask him if it was alright to get my key back so i can open the rear seat to get it...he looked surprised...i guess it was his 1st time pulling over a motorcycle :teeth

but yeah....now i know not to get off the bike until asked to..i always thought i should to show him i have no intent of running.

EDIT: the reason why he pulled me over was because i was following a bus to go up to Fairfield for an ROTC event. the new guy...the guy in charge (senior aerospace instuctor) didnt like me so he called the CHP saying that i was scaring the bus driver...he told the CHP i was circling the bus when in fact i was on its left side only...and i was switching lanes because people were tailgaiting me. *passengers in the bus witnessed it also and were backing me up* so yeah...CHP had a good laugh and let me off.

[T-1 Thunder]

What if you refused to take the helmet off?

Is there a law that says you have to, the way you HAVE TO take a breath test when asked?

What if you don't want to lift your face shield?

What can the cop do?

I'm just wondering. I'm sure there's a lot of folks with red eyes that would prefer to keep them hidden, and I wonder what the cop can do about it besides get upset.

Just curious - don't go accusing me of driving while high.

[motorman4life]

Originally posted by T-1 Thunder
What if you refused to take the helmet off?

Is there a law that says you have to, the way you HAVE TO take a breath test when asked?

What if you don't want to lift your face shield?

What can the cop do?

I'm just wondering. I'm sure there's a lot of folks with red eyes that would prefer to keep them hidden, and I wonder what the cop can do about it besides get upset.

Just curious - don't go accusing me of driving while high.
If they want to examine you for symptoms of intoxication or drug influence, refusing to remove the helmet would be a violation of 148 PC (resist, obstruct or delay a peace officer in the performance of their duties) and/or 2800 CVC (refuse to obey a lawful order of a peace officer).

Additionally, it is up to the officer whether they will release you on a citation or arrest you for the violation. If they are not satisfied with your ID or want to compare your face (assuming you are wearing a full-face helmet) to your ID photo, the helmet needs to come off before a citation is issued. Refusal to remove the helmet is the same as refusal to ID. If you are an operator, you are required to provide "adequate" ID before you can be released on a citation. Again, refusing to cooperate would be a clear violation of 148 PC and/or 2800 CVC

The helmet is comin' off.

[NorCalBusa]

Originally posted by Junkie
what do you think of putting the key in the gas tank?

It's a bitch to fish out after the stop is over...but whatever works dude.

[T-1 Thunder]

So basically, we may as well just remove the helmet from the start. It sounds like nobody has gone through a stop without removing it.

I hope you bust the chops on those punks that disobey you MM4L. If not, let us know and all you need to do is turn your head and we'll take care of em for ya, bud. ;)

[AndyM]

I've been pulled over by the CHP 2-3 times. As soon as I see their lights come on my right turn signal goes on and I'm heading for the shoulder. Turn off the bike, kickstand down, get off the bike, gloves off, helmet off.
They have never had a problem with this. I treat them with respect and they treat me the same way.
Amazing they way that works.

[nakedape]

What Whodat said, always works for me too. Pulled 2X (Soco Sheriff) but no tickets. helps to be the same race as the officer too (overwhelmingly white males)...Nape

[TheBestName]

Pull over and keep both hands on my helmet. haha

[nakedape]

Dragon, i live in rural SONOMA COUNTY. There are no blacks, asains, kikes, and a precious few lations. Most are some version of myself, racially(WASP or dago), and they always seem reluctant to cite and apologetic for pulling me, Address ME as 'sir', hope you have a nice day, wave as they drive away, et cetera.

Is that PC enough for you? Seriously, by the time I produce the docs and flash my "badge" (public servant, non LEO) they either recognize me from the community or seem to be thinking to themselves, "damn, I thought this guy was going to give me an excuse to open a can of whoopass".

CHP are the fucking rainbow flag nazi death squad from hell. Why are all the females bulldikes? Hell if I know, but the trio of village people rejects that arrested me and towed my bike had to be repelled with expensive lawyer spray come court time. I won, because they were wrong (busted down the misdemaenor to an infraction:troy ), but thank the good lord for divided freeways and declining funds for general traffic enforcement where I live.

I guess the rouge moto clubs you guys encourage/belong to draw all the heat southward. Watch your six....NApe

[Bad Kitty]

I like to pull off to the side as quickly as I see lights and stop with a record breaking endo... Then I hold out my arms as if t invite the officer to frisk me. I tell him I'll think about it when he asks for me to produce license and reg, then quip, "I need a license?"

I yell "police brutality!" before he even has time to ask me if I know why I was pulled over. Then when he goes back to the car, I turn my engine back on, whack on the throttle and go!

I've never had a ticket. That is all.

[}Dragon{]

Originally posted by nakedape
Seriously, by the time I produce the docs and flash my "badge" (public servant, non LEO) they either recognize me from the community or seem to be thinking to themselves, "damn, I thought this guy was going to give me an excuse to open a can of whoopass".


:rolleyes I think it's unprofessional to "buzz" a cop with your badge. I have one too, but have never used it to get out of a ticket.

As a matter of fact, I did get called on the carpet for "driving too fast to an incident" (MVC w/ a 16 y/o unconscious- ejected from a vehicle with a SO Deputy on scene requesting we step it up and ordering an airlift) in a company Expedition by an off-duty trooper. Was I going fast? Yeah about 20 over on a gravel road, but not faster than safe and prudent. I told my boss: Give the trooper my info and have him write me a cite otherwise go piss up a rope. He backed down :laughing. The Highway Patrol did not like our agency: One of the trooper's wives brought home one of my cow-orkers... I'll just leave it at that :laughing

My brother-in-law got pulled over in my sister's car, he was embarrassed to show his star.

[Junkie]

Originally posted by }Dragon{
:rolleyes I think it's unprofessional to "buzz" a cop with your badge. I have one too, but have never used it to get out of a ticket.

As a matter of fact, I did get called on the carpet for "driving too fast to an incident" (MVC w/ a 16 y/o unconscious- ejected from a vehicle with a SO Deputy on scene requesting we step it up and ordering an airlift) in a company Expedition by an off-duty trooper. Was I going fast? Yeah about 20 over on a gravel road, but not faster than safe and prudent. I told my boss: Give the trooper my info and have him write me a cite otherwise go piss up a rope. He backed down :laughing. The Highway Patrol did not like our agency: One of the trooper's wives brought home one of my cow-orkers... I'll just leave it at that :laughing

My brother-in-law got pulled over in my sister's car, he was embarrassed to show his star. 20 on a gravel road is enough to get pulled over? I've had construction crews lead me at 25-30... (CA166 was being repaved, and it was 100% gravel)

[}Dragon{]

Originally posted by Junkie
20 on a gravel road is enough to get pulled over? I've had construction crews lead me at 25-30... (CA166 was being repaved, and it was 100% gravel)

Well it was 45 in a 25... which gave off a nice plume of dust :laughing

Thank God I didn't have a Subaru.

http://www.imagineer.co.jp/imagi_n/pc/colin/image/colin04.jpg

[Junkie]

Originally posted by }Dragon{
Well it was 45 in a 25... which gave off a nice plume of dust :laughing

Thank God I didn't have a Subaru.

http://www.imagineer.co.jp/imagi_n/pc/colin/image/colin04.jpg err, I wasn't thinking you meant 20 over the limit for some reason. Still, it's certainly possible to safely do 45 on gravel, and I've done it in a damn Integra

[nakedape]

Got you Dragon! My "badge" is my staff ID card from a public school! I know who all the kids with cop parents are, because at the start of the school year, I have them write a biography which includes parent occupations and then memorize, quickly, which of my kids have cop parents.

more than once the "conversation" starts with, " I know another Anderson, she's my student 1st period English and said her dad was a cop". That's my daughter, dude, she loves your class. Ticketing ends, gladhanding and smalltalk begins.

Call it unprofessional if you wish, but i call it survival on my salary...NApe

[nakedape]

No thanks, the last batch was pot-laced and made some fool teachers sick, although it didn't make the papers.

I find your board silly but fun and I remember WAY back when Alan said "best forum ever, check it out".

props to BARFERS, you do it well, and there is a certain flavor that screams "bay area" unlike other national boards.

I look forward to flaming you in the future Dragon, and vice versa. Aint the internet fun? NApe

[silversvs]

You two need to get a room.

[RRR70]

Originally posted by silversvs
You two need to get a room. :laughing :shhh :love

[motorman4life]

.

http://www.bayarearidersforum.com/forums/images/threads/000/189/537/2980966-gaydar.jpg

[Bad Kitty]

Howcome nobody laughs at my dumb jokes? Just the ghey leghumping gets attention around here? Supwidat?

Nape, you'll have good times with my man dragon, we love a good flaming around here, not.

[}Dragon{]

Originally posted by Nice Kitty
Nape, you'll have good times with my man dragon, we love a good flaming around here, not.

At least there is a teacher on here who can spell now. :laughing (Sorry Corky! :toothless)

[nakedape]

We're having a flaming good time here! To think I need an email to tell me a crazy BARFER has juxtaposed gayness and large guns...sigh.

Someday I'll contribute something non-gay, I promise, in the meantime you can all go back to the "My lover was cut off and I was pissed so I had to really do him in the butt hard"...

The most attuned gaydar in the world registers zero here guys and gals. I currently have a GF and mistress, but I'll save the "match.com" perversity for another thread....NApe

[dkcwenge]

Originally posted by Junkie
what do you think of putting the key in the gas tank?Originally posted by NorCalBusa
It's a bitch to fish out after the stop is over...but whatever works dude.

i think he meant inserting the key in the cap, not dropping it into the gas tank

[Junkie]

Originally posted by dkcwenge
i think he meant inserting the key in the cap, not dropping it into the gas tank I think he knows that and is just kidding

[The Raizuli]

One thing my dad recommended to me is to pull the keys and drop them to one side of the bike in an obvious manner, so that the officer can see that if you try to go for them, he can introduce his knee to your face or his stick/elbow/ASP to the back of your neck, or both.

[silversvs]

Originally posted by nakedape
I currently have a GF and mistress,

Do they know each other?

[T-1 Thunder]

Why and how did this thread turn into a subject remotely related to gayness and mistresses?

You folks need a hero. Am I the poster boy?

[Razel]

Originally posted by The Raizuli
One thing my dad recommended to me is to pull the keys and drop them to one side of the bike in an obvious manner, so that the officer can see that if you try to go for them, he can introduce his knee to your face or his stick/elbow/ASP to the back of your neck, or both. There was a further suggestion that dropping the keys might cause a bit of concern on the officers part, as it's reflective of a prior felony stop...:teeth