Outgrowing a Bike

[sinncere]

On the subject of outgrowing a bike, I wonder if people (especially new riders) have a good grasp of what this means. Or more importantly, what does it mean to outgrow a bike?

A lot of good folks recommend the 250's (or maybe just ONE 250) or 500's as beginner bikes, but there's always the ever ubiquitous outgrowing issue latched on with it.

Normally, what do people mean by outgrowing a bike? In what way?

Is it when a rider has become comfortable with everything there is about riding, not so much the bike? When the rider has a good grasp over the basics of riding and can adequately practice control over their machine in any, if not the most common of situations?

Or is it when a rider has really pushed their bikes to the limit? Keep in mind we are still talking about new riders here, where the chances of the rider becoming comfortable with their bike without really pushing it to the limit is more likely than the rider having experienced and mastered the ins and out of operating their bike in its maximum potential. After all, that's why the beginner bikes are marked as such - to help the rider learn to control a machine without being overwhelmed by the machine itself.

Or is outgrowing a bike really just as simple as wanting to go faster, as quick as the twist of the throttle? Is there a clear concept of the word, or is it subjective to every rider?

I've been riding for a bit now, and I'm still not sure of when does one actually outgrow a bike.

[Mudda Focker]

i really wanna know also.
i was told that 600's were a good way to start...but after a year or 2 i would out grow it..
how will i outgrow it??

[sinncere]

Originally posted by jFlightMoTo
i really wanna know also.
i was told that 600's were a good way to start...but after a year or 2 i would out grow it..
how will i outgrow it??

Right.

In my case, I had an older 600 myself, which I bought after I bought my 500. In between riding the two bikes, the 600 didn't really sway me away from the 500, and I even ended up selling the 600 off.

But I don't think I outgrew either one.

[ntula]

well, it used to be if you did not want to outgrow a bike, you got a busa for your first. now, you will probably outgrow that in a few weeks and should go with the zx14.

j/k

IMO

there is a point when you feel the bike 'holds you back' or that you are riding longer, you need a more comfortable bike. *depends on the first bike. being able to feel confident in handling and comfortable is all you really need. you may want to get a more powerful bike or larger bike if it is more confortable for you, but it really depends on what your style and target is, and you may not really need the extra power or make application of the added potential velocity*. getting a bike too 'big'/much to handle is worse than having one that you feel you have outgrown.

[Z3n]

There is no such thing as outgrowing a motorcycle. There is always more that a single motorcycle can teach you. (See, garyj)

However, you may grow bored with a motorcycle, may not feel it's worth your time, it may not make you smile when you swing a leg over it...and at that point you've moved on...although i had not outgrown my previous bike (the zx-6e) it no longer inspired me when i rode it, so i decided, for better or for worse, to get something different. Now i have a SS bike that's way, way beyond my abilities, especially on the street. Anyone who thinks that they've outgrown the limits of their bike is going to have a rude awakening when they're smoked by some old man on a beater mid 90's 600...i know a few, i can introduce you if you'd like...:laughing

[sinncere]

Originally posted by Z3n
Anyone who thinks that they've outgrown the limits of their bike is going to have a rude awakening when they're smoked by some old man on a beater mid 90's 600...i know a few, i can introduce you if you'd like...:laughing

Those are the kind of people I'd rather be riding with. :teeth

So to outgrow a motorcycle is not to exhaust everything the bike can give you, but just to want more than what you already have?

[Z3n]

Originally posted by sinncere
Those are the kind of people I'd rather be riding with. :teeth

So to outgrow a motorcycle is not to exhaust everything the bike can give you, but just to want more than what you already have?

Or just want something different. There's nothing wrong with wanting to ride something different.

What people often catagorize as "outgrowing" the bike is the feeling of comfort you develop with the speed and power of a motorcycle. In fact, until that occurs, you can't start being able to start learning how to handle the motorcycle...you're so intimidated and shocked by the speed that you hit tunnel vision every time you open the throttle, and can't deal with twisting the grip and dealing with the other aspects of riding the bike. Everything feels slow eventually, and that "slow" feeling is good...it shows your mind is capable of dealing with the majority of the acceleration of the bike on it's own, andyou can focus on other areas to begin developing your skills.

[sinncere]

Originally posted by Z3n
Or just want something different. There's nothing wrong with wanting to ride something different.


Agreed. I just wouldn't classify that as outgrowing a bike.

See what I'm thinking is that new riders might think that their ability to be comfortable going fast on a straight on their bike is equivalent to having mastered their machine, and that the logical (and perhaps only way) to go from there is to go to a bike that will do the exact same thing quicker, and reaching higher speeds.

Like you said, achieving that state where you're comfortable going fast (or faster) is a good thing, cause it frees you from the anxiety of whether or not you could control it, and therefore allowing you to focus on other facets of riding.

I'm just hoping that new riders don't think that being comfortable going faster is a sign that they need to move on to higher grounds.

[racerXgirl]

What most people refer to as 'outgrow' when it comes to the lil Ninja's are the power. Can that Ninja do just about everything else that any of the big bikes can do? 99% absolutely yes. It won't go in a straight line at 150 mpg, but is it a comfortable commuting bike? Is it a fun bike to hit up the twisties in? Can you take that thing and ring it out on the track? Absolutely.

[Ironbutt]

Originally posted by sinncere
On the subject of outgrowing a bike, I wonder if people (especially new riders) have a good grasp of what this means. Or more importantly, what does it mean to outgrow a bike?

A lot of good folks recommend the 250's (or maybe just ONE 250) or 500's as beginner bikes, but there's always the ever ubiquitous outgrowing issue latched on with it.

Normally, what do people mean by outgrowing a bike? In what way?




A 250cc bike at 70 mph fatigues the rider more than a 1100cc at the same speed, wouldn't you think? So the smaller machines are good up to a point but after awhile your like "man this just hurts".

So when your ready to grow hair on your butt; and see if your jowls flap at 150mph, you "outgrow" your current ride..


;)

[Baptistro]

Originally posted by racerXgirl
It won't go in a straight line at 150 mpg, but is it a comfortable commuting bike?

What will? With gas prices the way they are, I'm all over that :drool








































:twofinger

[Mudda Focker]

for me to "outgrow " a bike is wanting more powerful bike.
i was recomended a 750 because its right before a 1000 and a little stronger than a 600. right in he middle :p

[Z3n]

Originally posted by jFlightMoTo
for me to "outgrow " a bike is wanting more powerful bike.
i was recomended a 750 because its right before a 1000 and a little stronger than a 600. right in he middle :p

So you've outgrown a 250, a 500, and a 600 already? Impressive...:lol

[Mudda Focker]

^ lol hell no
but i wanna start with a 750. :)


i only have moneyfor 1 bike so i guess im gunna be in the parking lot after work for a couple of weeks until i can handle its power completly

[Baptistro]

I have a 1000, and a 400, and my ride of choice for every day riding is the 400 hands down. My next bike is also probably going to be a 125 :)

[Z3n]

Originally posted by jFlightMoTo
^ lol hell no
but i wanna start with a 750. :)


i only have moneyfor 1 bike so i guess im gunna be in the parking lot after work for a couple of weeks until i can handle its power completly

You don't need or want a 750. Buy a 600 if you're so convinced that you're too big or whatever for a 250 or a 500. Find a cheap older one, one that's already been dropped, or if it hasn't, one that you don't mind dropping. Then again, i'm sure you've already heard all of this in your "what bike should i buy" thread...:rolleyes

[Mudda Focker]

^ actually im too much of a nooblet to find that thread....
i gotta check that out after i get off work.

i want a 750 but a 600 would not be bad... after im done saving up my money...ill get what i can. plus gears...my budget is only 5000 for a used bike and 500 on gears...im pretty broke :(

[MrCrash]

Originally posted by Z3n
...although i had not outgrown my previous bike (the zx-6e) it no longer inspired me when i rode it

Even after throwing a leg over all kinds of different bikes over the years, I haven't found anything that works as well for my kind of street riding as my old ZX-6E! I'm not criticizing your impression at all - I know I'm weird that way when it comes to "The Couch" :)

Originally posted by racerXgirl
What most people refer to as 'outgrow' when it comes to the lil Ninja's are the power. Can that Ninja do just about everything else that any of the big bikes can do? 99% absolutely yes.

That 1% = the fun passenger rides I like to do :)

[Z3n]

Originally posted by CityBikeMike
Even after throwing a leg over all kinds of different bikes over the years, I haven't found anything that works as well for my kind of street riding as my old ZX-6E! I'm not criticizing your impression at all - I know I'm weird that way when it comes to "The Couch" :)
Yeah...i really like the E...and i figure that after a few years of womenizing with other motorcycles, i'll probably spend the rest of my motorcycle career looking for another ZX6E...:laughing As i said, it was still an excellent bike...it just didn't stir the soul anymore, like it did before....I'm sure one day soon, i'll feel the same way about the CBR, and go out and buy something else like the mindless consumer i am...:laughing


That 1% = the fun passenger rides I like to do :)
That is one of the few problems with the 250...:laughing

[Z3n]

Originally posted by jFlightMoTo
^ actually im too much of a nooblet to find that thread....
i gotta check that out after i get off work.

i want a 750 but a 600 would not be bad... after im done saving up my money...ill get what i can. plus gears...my budget is only 5000 for a used bike and 500 on gears...im pretty broke :(

Sorry, i missed your post earlier. If you're really interested, i'd be happy to help you find a bike. You can find an excellent, nice shape, late model 600 for 4.5k easy, and take the extra 500 and put it into gear...trust me, it'll be better that way.

[GhostRider]

this is the ONLY way anyone here will ever outgrow a 250:

http://www.ridingsun.com/files/ridingsun-scooterGuy.JPG

everything else is only to pose at starbucks.

[Enchanter]

Originally posted by Ironbutt
A 250cc bike at 70 mph fatigues the rider more than a 1100cc at the same speed, wouldn't you think? So the smaller machines are good up to a point but after awhile your like "man this just hurts".
I think that the original poster is referring to engine displacement rather than the physical size of the motorcycle. Yes they are somewhat related, but we need to make sure that we are all on the same page in this discussion.

[Enchanter]

Originally posted by Baptistro
My next bike is also probably going to be a 125 :) A 125 what? I have a shitload of Rainbows I need to get rid of.....

Seriously, which 125?

[Baptistro]

KTM SX125 :p

[racerXgirl]

Originally posted by CityBikeMike

That 1% = the fun passenger rides I like to do :)

I've been lucky enough to be one of your passengers :teeth

Please don't get rid of the couch! I'm looking forward to getting back to the track, applying what you've taught me and getting another ride from ya!

[Mudda Focker]

Originally posted by Z3n
Sorry, i missed your post earlier. If you're really interested, i'd be happy to help you find a bike. You can find an excellent, nice shape, late model 600 for 4.5k easy, and take the extra 500 and put it into gear...trust me, it'll be better that way.

i still need to come up with the money first :( thx for the offer tho ill be sure to PM u when i get the money :p

[Sidewalk]

When I think outgrown, I think of a newbie who has learned hot to twist the throttle to the stop and hold on until the bike has topped out.

Typically when I hear of someone who needs a bigger bike for longer rides, I don't hear them say they have outgrown it.

Originally posted by jFlightMoTo
^ lol hell no
but i wanna start with a 750. :)


i only have moneyfor 1 bike so i guess im gunna be in the parking lot after work for a couple of weeks until i can handle its power completly You think a few weeks in a parking lot will allow you to learn how to handle the power of ANY bike completely?

Dude, learn some lessons from the rest of us and wise up. Get something A LOT smaller and wait. You can almost always buy a 250/500 and turn around and sell it for the same price. Saying you can't afford to do that is rediculous, especially after considering how much more insurance will be.

I started out on something with similar HP as an older 600, and I regret it. I wish I would have started on an EX250, part of which is why I still want one. But instead I am getting a YSR50 so I can get my small bike fix. Small bikes really teach you how to ride, big bikes teach you how to hold on.

If you are going to let your ego get in the way, then at least consider the SV650.

[Mudda Focker]

yea i do think if i practice for a couple of weeks ill be able to handle a 750...different people have different learning curve..its about practice. its not like its gunna be my first time on a bike..ive had 250's before just not in the US ....
edit
i am considiring starting with a 600 ;) like i said before ill get what i can..thx for the advice tho :twofinger

[Mudda Focker]

you know what...the guy who i talked to was pretty young (mid 20's)and he doesnt have his license..he has 2 bikes tho.he also advised me to just run from the cops cuz they wont catch a motorcycle....

yea i think ill start with a 600.Sidewalk you were right i think my ego just wanted a bigger engine. thx for enlightening me!

[Sidewalk]

Originally posted by jFlightMoTo
yea i think ill start with a 600. I don't know anyone who doesn't like thier SV650. A guy I know does some serious racing on one. His Ducati mostly stays parked.

[Z3n]

Originally posted by Sidewalk
I don't know anyone who doesn't like thier SV650. A guy I know does some serious racing on one. His Ducati mostly stays parked.

SV's are excellent motorcycles...i want to race one soon :)

[nubcakes]

But they're soooooo ugly.

[Sidewalk]

Originally posted by nubcakes
But they're soooooo ugly. Really?

http://www.bayarearidersforum.com/forums/images/threads/000/200/848/3108330-img_2687.jpg

[Sidewalk]

More whoring:

http://bayarearidersforum.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=201580

[snowface]

my first bike was a 2000 CB750 Nighthawk. i never outgrew it, and in many ways, it was perfect. i could drop it and nothing would break. the valves self-adjusted. it could handle anything (including a ride to boise, ID). it was very comfortable. it had just enough power for most fwy needs and the twisties. it would never get stolen, and didn't mind sitting outside.

however, i did not like the single-disc front brake and rear drum brake, it did not have the stopping power for it's weight.

i didn't like the lack of torque or top-end pull. it was faster than most cars, but would lose steam above 75mph on the fwy.

i didn't like the dated suspension. i'd get serious headshake on the fwy when hitting bumps or changing lanes.

so i finally decided after more than a year on the 'hawk, to upgrade to my B12S. it's no supersport, but in everyway the hawk lacked (torque and top-end power, suspension, brakes) i achieved MASSIVE improvements. i will never outgrow this bike, but it was definately an improvement for only a few bucks more.

outgrowing is a mentality. just ride what makes you smile and fits your style... :)

[silverbelt]

You don't really outgrow a bike, you just want something different. 600 vs 1000, V-twin vs inline4, italian bikes, supermotards, etc, etc.

I do think every serious rider should own at least one ducati in their lifetime.

[grymlocke]

physically, yes you can 'out grow' a bike...

case in point:swaaaay back when I was a high school freshman I had a honda XL125 ('73ish) and it was great, ran good, fit like a glove.

...but know, 20+ years later, I'd feel (and look) like a circus bear in the center ring on it...(<6' tall then, now 6'6"+ and a whole lot heavier )

[Bad Kitty]

Originally posted by GhostRider
this is the ONLY way anyone here will ever outgrow a 250:

http://www.ridingsun.com/files/ridingsun-scooterGuy.JPG

everything else is only to pose at starbucks.

OMG!!!!!!!! How did you get that picture of me!!!! He swore it was burned!!!!

:laughing

[achung123]

Interesting question... in fact, I has just posted a question about 'upgrading' from my Duc 620i into something more touring like kind of bike - like F800ST or VFR. Thinking of it.. I never use the term 'out grow'... since to me it is about like the bike or not. I am shopping for the next bike, doesn't mean that I will sell my old one, or I lost interest in it... I just want a different kind of bike. I may eat dust when a S4R fly by; but I believe I have the same amount of fun as any other riders. Just have fun with whatever you feel like.

And yes, I think every rider should own a Ducati some point in their lifetime.

[Sidewalk]

Originally posted by achung123
I may eat dust when a S4R fly by It is the rider, not the bike. I have seen a particular Aprilia Futura with 0 chicken strips (front or rear tire) because the guy can ride extremely well, and seen GSXR600's with totally new riders who can't make it across an intersection without dragging thier feet. Trust me, he could probably make most S4R riders look silly.

[robscomputer]

I started on a Ninja 250 and went to a SV650S then a KTM 640. I personally didn't out grew the 250 but wanted more power and a slightly better performance. People like Gary J prove it's the rider and not the bike.

Also after a while it's hard to ride a little bike for long distances, you start to want smooth power for passing, better suspesnion and powerful brakes.

That being said, I miss the 250. It's so easy to ride, I may buy one again.

[Grunz]

I think a Ninja 250 is an excellent bike to learn on and an hour or so on friends Ninja helped me a lot to move from the MSF to an F4i which is my first bike.

That said I don't think I would enjoy motorcycling as much with only the Ninja 250 as I do with the F4i. F4i is smoother, more powerful (very good in real world traffic), has better brakes and suspension and is more comfortable for me.

Still, I've seen GaryJ ride his Ninja 250 so i know that bike is very good on the twisties with a skilled rider. As for outgrowing the F4i, the way i see it Nicky Hayden was winning national championships on that bike 4 years ago so that bike is much more capable than my skills can take advantage of today.