How frequently freshen motor?

[tlsmikey]

How frequently do you guys freshen up your motors?

Anyone experienced catastrophic failure from not freshening one up after a couple of seasons?

[joe]

depends on what it is. If it's a bone stock motor and the compression numbers are still good and the HP hasn't really changed, who cares. If it's a race motor with high compression head w/OEM everything else, you might as well every off season if you've got the time/money although it will only lose a little hp over time (your experience may vary). If it's a full on race motor with ti this and high comp that, then definitely rebuild it once per year if not more. You'd like to keep those compression numbers high and breaking stuff might cost more than rebuilding. Plus, the whole point of having a pumped motor is it's pumped, and if you're losing HP over time it's a waste.

The question is, if you're hammering on your motor every year and you want to be failure free, why not rebuilding it or at least go over it in the off season?

Long story short, if you don't have the money for it on an OEM (or near OEM) motor and the valves are in spec, the compression is fine, it shifts fine, etc, don't worry about it.

[Mick-e]

How frequently do you guys freshen up your motors?

Anyone experienced catastrophic failure from not freshening one up after a couple of seasons?

How frequent? On a bone stock motor every other season. Maybe every third depending on how much riding you do.

Yes I've seen catastrophic failures, and usually when you don't want them. Like when you're chasing someone into T8 at T-hill. It's the crank and rods you're most worried about. Otherwise it's just compression and a little hp which is no big deal. It seems in the AFM your bike will be out of date and not competitive far before you actually wear out the motor and sell it to a trackday guy.
So if you're at the point that you think you need a rebuild it's probably time to buy a new bike.

[tlsmikey]

Thanks guys, that's about what I thought.

My current bike is an 05 with 1 1/2 seasons of racing on it and another 1/2 season of me working it on track days to get up to speed. My biggest concern is the "clunk" going into 2nd and some occasional false neutrals between 4th and 5th (occasional, meaning 2-3 times per track day).

I'm not fast enough to care about the horsepower, but a catastrophic failure would probably take me and the bike out together. Hmmm....it's only money right? :cry

[Mick-e]

There has to be piles of wadded 05 gsxr's out there. I mean every damn SV has a gsxr front end. Perhaps just a low mileage stock engine is all you need. Then you have your old motor as a back up.

[Trackho]

Thanks guys, that's about what I thought.

My current bike is an 05 with 1 1/2 seasons of racing on it and another 1/2 season of me working it on track days to get up to speed. My biggest concern is the "clunk" going into 2nd and some occasional false neutrals between 4th and 5th (occasional, meaning 2-3 times per track day).

I'm not fast enough to care about the horsepower, but a catastrophic failure would probably take me and the bike out together. Hmmm....it's only money right? :cry

Hate to say it--but it sounds like the trannys going--might want to have it looked at

[tlsmikey]

true, but most of the ebay motors are around $1200. What's the cost of a motor freshen? ~$1200-1500. Almost a wash.

[MackeyStingray]

but what's the history of those ebay motors?

[PINNITT]

far better to buy a new bike if it's within your budget....

Suzuki pays thru 10th (im sure i'll be corrected by someone if this isn't the case for 08') but only if your bike is less than 2yrs old.....

[TWF]

some gsxr have issue with tranny here and there.good news is replacing couple gears is piece of cake.

[Mick-e]

some gsxr have issue with tranny here and there.good news is replacing couple gears is piece of cake.

:Party
Cake? Is there going to be a party too?
:Party

[TWF]

ice cream

[2shott]

true, but most of the ebay motors are around $1200. What's the cost of a motor freshen? ~$1200-1500. Almost a wash.

If you could afford it I would certainly get a stock engine and run it while your engine could be getting work done to it.

far better to buy a new bike if it's within your budget....

Suzuki pays thru 10th (im sure i'll be corrected by someone if this isn't the case for 08') but only if your bike is less than 2yrs old.....

...but you would have to be running top ten in 750P and/or 750SB in order to even qualify- I would say it's better to beat-on your current 05 GSXR and see how you run. If you can consistently run in the top five, only then would I invest $10k in new bike and $10k in mods....:ride

some gsxr have issue with tranny here and there.good news is replacing couple gears is piece of cake.

This is probably the best news of all. If you can afford it, you could have Zoran go through your motor and put in fresh gears, bearings, rings, etc, and check it all out and make sure it's ready to rock...:cool

[tlsmikey]

Thanks for all the replies so far. I'm not going to be fast enough to place top 10 so there's no reason for me to think about contingency money (this will be my rookie season). In fact, if I finish top 20 in production i'll be dancing. :ride

I have decided to pull the motor and have it looked at, especially the tranny. I'm not too worried about the motor holding together, but I am concerned about a dozen more track days and eight race weekends worth of abuse. I don't think it would make it through the whole season and the thought of scrambling between races to fix breakage doesn't sound like much fun.

Anyways, motor came out last night after a couple of hours and i'll know what i've got shortly.

[joe]

To pull the tranny on that bike and go through it is easy, like Z said. At a dealer it might cost, but through a local engine builder or mechanic is should be less than 500 with parts. No worries on the bearings and what not, unless you get that far into the motor.

Replace the rounded gears, all the shift forks (if you can afford it) and the applicable screws and circlips. Good to go.

[ryanb]

note that Joe has admirable mechanical skills, as illustrated by him working his "magic" here:

http://www.4theriders.com/pics/trackdays/2008/thill-01.18.08/01.18.08/JOE/IMG_1201.JPG

[Ducky_Fresh]

Nothin like truing a rotor. :)

[joe]

haters. Ryan, now that you have a bike (well, 75% of a bike) doesn't mean you get to chime back in. And speaking of which, what round to you plan on piling that sucker up at?

Not that the two trannies are the same, but heres a link to a quick rebuild of a transmission (not incredibely thorough) http://846racing.com/transmission.html

Hope that helps.

[ryanb]

haters. Ryan, now that you have a bike (well, 75% of a bike) doesn't mean you get to chime back in. And speaking of which, what round to you plan on piling that sucker up at?

Depends on how I feel after some trackdays and training. April at the earliest, but most likely May or June is the soonest I can see myself holding another yard sale.


Not that the two trannies are the same, but heres a link to a quick rebuild of a transmission (not incredibely thorough) http://846racing.com/transmission.html

Hope that helps.

Yep, Joe knows trannies for sure.

[Jackdog]

Thanks guys, that's about what I thought.

My current bike is an 05 with 1 1/2 seasons of racing on it and another 1/2 season of me working it on track days to get up to speed. My biggest concern is the "clunk" going into 2nd and some occasional false neutrals between 4th and 5th (occasional, meaning 2-3 times per track day).

I'm not fast enough to care about the horsepower, but a catastrophic failure would probably take me and the bike out together. Hmmm....it's only money right? :cryI got just what you need for that clunk.. sent you a pm

[tlsmikey]

Thanks for the help guys. I'm taking it over to Patrick at Performance Concepts today. He's gonna take a look at it and freshen up the whole thing for me.

I've built a few car motors, but this close to the start of a season I don't trust myself to get it together in time. In fact, i'm nervous about getting this thing back in time from Patrick but we'll see how it ends up.

[AFM535]

this close to the start of a season I don't trust myself to get it together in time.

This close? You've got forever. When you're meeting Zoran on the side of the highway on Thursday evening for a 3rd driven gear that didn't show up in your order, your bike's in pieces on your buddy's garage floor, and you're racing that weekend... then you're getting close. Ya, that was fun.

Thanks again Z :)

[#1Freak]

lol greg!

[ZXR400SP]

Have no fear, Patrick does great work!!!

[Trackho]

Have no fear, Patrick does great work!!!

Ditto--Patrick is awesome