Need help with tires

[Oneup]

I just bought a 07 CBR600rr to use for trackdays and to hopefully race. The only problem I am having is finding tires for it. I was wondering what kind of DOT race tires you guys reccommend. Also what I should expect to pay for a set, how long they generally last, and if rear tire size makes a difference. I have been able to find 190 rears cheaper than 180s but the size on my bike is 180. It has a 5.5" rear so 190s should fit. What do you guys think?

[afmotorsports]

Oh boy... here we go again, let's everybody jump in to plug your sponsors and why they're the best and everybody else sucks. :laughing:laughing

How 'bout this, here's the list of all the tire guys for the AFM races, call them up and find out their prices and what sizes they recommend. Nobody makes a bad tire these days, the debates are about as valuable as arguments about which flavor of ice cream is the best.

Call Terry for Dunlops: www.sporttire.com
Call Mark for Pirelli: www.superbiketires.net
Call Harley for Bridgestone: (oops, don't have his website handy, somebody post it up please)
...and you can call me for Michelins. :teeth

[Oneup]

Thanks for the info. Didn't realize at first what I was getting into.

[afmotorsports]

No worries. Tire debates, synthetic oil debates, trackday debates, etc. have all been played out on just about every forum, not just Barf... Just about everybody claims they're not biased (coughbull$hitcough) and you pretty much learn nothing. Most tire guys don't badmouth each other like some of their sponsored riders bash the competition. Your best bet is to just try different stuff and make up your own mind about which one suits you best. :thumbup

[Zerox]

In the AFM, I would be more concerned about finding a tire vendor that actually shows up for every race, with an ample supply of tires in the sizes and compounds your specific bike uses. :laughing

[Carey322]

Bridgestone - Harley Barnes - (707) 738-8238

Don't know if he has a website

[afm199]

Any of the race tires. Just use a 180. If you want to buy 190s ( some folks do) there are a whole new set of problems you need to be aware of.

[Holeshot]

Actually, that's no entirely true Ernie...it depends on the brand. Dunlops Ntec in a 190 is the dunlop ticket and the PR's in 180's are the Michelin ticket. I've also heard good stuff about the Bridgestones but no idea in sizes...

[afm199]

Berto I was referring to the fact that the 190s can have a wide range of diameters, thus changing the ride height and handling. The Ntec is a good tire, but the OP was talking 190s without mentioning anything else, and the worst possible thing he could do is get a 190/50 and lower his ride height.

[Carey322]

The Bridgestone 190/55 works great on a 5.5" wheel. I've been running them for a year plus on a 5.5" wheel. The Bridgestone 190/55 DOT is 1-2mm taller than the newest Pirelli 180/55 DOT. The Front was the same as the Pirelli. I switched tires on a bike recently and measured for the change. I can't remember the exact numbers from the Dunlop 190/60 to the Bridgestone 190/55, but the Bridgestone is a bit shorter. The fronts were pretty close, 1-2mm I think.

Also didn't Dunlop stop making the good tires (UK made) in the 180 width? I thought I heard that at a trackday end of last year. I could be wrong, wouldn't be the first time.

[Mjollnir]

Berto I was referring to the fact that the 190s can have a wide range of diameters, thus changing the ride height and handling. The Ntec is a good tire, but the OP was talking 190s without mentioning anything else, and the worst possible thing he could do is get a 190/50 and lower his ride height.


Just make sure to get some digital calipers and raise the front end to exactly match the increased height at the rear from the huge 190 race tires (my '07 seems much more reactive to geometry changes than any other bike I've owned - awesome when you get it right though).

[Oneup]

thanks for all of the info. I guess I should have been more specific on the tire size question. I am wondering how changing tire sizes will affect the way my bike handles (both heigth and width). I haven't had a chance to ride the bike yet and the tires that are on it are shot.

[Seesm]

I can give you a un-biased opinion... Cuz I pay for my tires most of the time...

I have run dunlops 208's and 209's with those feeling very good I tried Pirellis and I liked them even a little better... I currently run Pirellis now and I like them but YES I TOO pay for those most everytime...


I will hopefully go testing with Alex soon and be able to tell you how great the Michelens are... :)

I keep hinting at this but he never replies so it is hard to plug him... :) On the bridgestones I think they have some good one too... Truly with nay tire set your going to get different things each tire does best... I have spoke to many a racer that has told me why he likes a certain tire... blah blah blah..

But truly try them all out for yourself and have a guy like Dave Moss at Catalyst Reaction Suspension or someone competent like him set your bike for each set after you mount them and see what works best for YOU.. I can not tell you my firend's name but he is a factory rider. And when I asked "what tires should I run?"

He said "For sure run the black ones, but they have to be the round ones" Basically whatever you get the best deal on he said..

No shit he told me they all do things good and do some things bad... YOu will love em all for certain things and hate em for others... He said he would run any tire as long as he got to get used to them a bit before racing on them.

Alex? YOu there? When are we going testing? :)

[afmotorsports]

Alex? YOu there? When are we going testing? :)

Your timing is perfect, maybe even your subtle "hook-a-brutha-up"... :laughing :laughing

I just got back last night from our annual meeting with Michelin US and there is definitely some very cool stuff going on for 2008. Most of it should be in my warehouse in the next three weeks or so. If you know Dave Moss, he also has some of that info from the test at Jennings that Bobby Fong attended. I can't say too much, but the new DOT front is a HUGE step forward (far exceeding Michelin's expectations for the test), several new DOT rears (both 180/55 and 190/55), new 17" slicks (front and rears, especially a biga$$ 19/69-17 for liter bikes!) and new 16.5s (which I should get after Daytona).

After the huge success we had in 2006 (including every single 600, 650 and 750 championship and four top 10 plates!), 2007 wasn't quite as good. With some new ammo in our belt, I feel really good about giving my old friend Terry a run for his money again... :teeth

[Archimedes]

I'm running 208GPa's on my 07RR for trackdays and I really like em. 180 on the back.

[Pakow]

Alex, you have email! :ride

[Zerox]

I can't say too much, but the new DOT front is a HUGE step forward (far exceeding Michelin's expectations for the test), several new DOT rears (both 180/55 and 190/55), new 17" slicks (front and rears, especially a biga$$ 19/69-17 for liter bikes!) and new 16.5s (which I should get after Daytona).

What about the 160/60 used on the prestigious SV650? :teeth

[Corey11c]

There was a guy at either AFM or a trackday (I can't remember) they kept seeing puffs of smoke coming from his bike on the front straight. Finally black flagged him thinking it was oil, turned out he had a 190 on a 600 and it was rubbing the swingarm at high speeds when the tire would expand

[afmotorsports]

What about the 160/60 used on the prestigious SV650? :teeth

I will definitely be using the new DOT front with either a Soft or Med/Soft 160rear. The 160 rear has been really good for us in the past few years (two 2nds overall in F4 and 650Twins with Dan Sewell last year and Kurt Spencer used to win everything with that rear tire).

btw, did you see the 2008 Michelin contingency, particularly the new 650 Production class?? :teeth

http://www.afmotorsports.com/contingency.html

Michelin is putting up almost eighty grand for AFM racers in 2008... ok, I'm biased, but I think that's pretty cool. :cool

[afmotorsports]

There was a guy at either AFM or a trackday (I can't remember) they kept seeing puffs of smoke coming from his bike on the front straight. Finally black flagged him thinking it was oil, turned out he had a 190 on a 600 and it was rubbing the swingarm at high speeds when the tire would expand

That's not the tire's fault, it's the mechanic. No need to name names, but some tires' construction allows them to "grow" at high speeds (typically if they're not built with zero-degree belts) - if you pay attention to what the tire vendor tells you then you know how much clearance you need to the swingarm and it's not an issue at all. Often times this mistake happens when people change gearing (bigger rear sprocket, shorter wheelbase) and forget to check swingarm clearance. I seem to remember that at Daytona the AMA had a 14mm spacer that they used to check swingarm clearance during tech. As far as I know, there's nothing fundamentally wrong with a tire "growing" at high speeds as long as you leave sufficient clearance for the swingarm.

[Zerox]

btw, did you see the 2008 Michelin contingency, particularly the new 650 Production class?? :teeth

http://www.afmotorsports.com/contingency.html


That's good stuff, kudos to Michelin. Do you know the height of the Michelin 160/60 compared to the Pirelli SuperCorsa Pro 160/60? I was wondering if the Michelin is taller than the Pirelli.

[afmotorsports]

Don't know the numbers, but it's very easy to measure and calculate differences in diameter.

[afm199]

That's not the tire's fault, it's the mechanic. No need to name names, but some tires' construction allows them to "grow" at high speeds (typically if they're not built with zero-degree belts) - if you pay attention to what the tire vendor tells you then you know how much clearance you need to the swingarm and it's not an issue at all. Often times this mistake happens when people change gearing (bigger rear sprocket, shorter wheelbase) and forget to check swingarm clearance. I seem to remember that at Daytona the AMA had a 14mm spacer that they used to check swingarm clearance during tech. As far as I know, there's nothing fundamentally wrong with a tire "growing" at high speeds as long as you leave sufficient clearance for the swingarm.

When the 195 70 Dunlop slick came out, it needed a minumum of 10 mm clearance. I remember buying some of those really cheap, they had a one inch wide scuff down the middle and one lap on them.

[Zerox]

Don't know the numbers, but it's very easy to measure and calculate differences in diameter.

How am I supposed to do that when my SV is at Bud Anderson's house? :laughing

I'd like to try these Michelins on my SV. :Port