went down today

I was lane splitting on my way to work this morning. A bit ahead two cars almost merged into each other. I started a hard brake when the back wheel just went out from under me. Guessing I hit some oil as I'm used to the paint being slick but it's hard to know.

I'm ok, and the bike is still ride-able (more or less). The cager behind me stopped helped me get my bike up and waited with me until I could go. I'm thankful for his help and I'm thankful he didn't run me over.

you all stay safe.

just a little advice I got from my much more experienced buddies...commuting on bike is something not so good itself, since your senses and the cagers' senses are not all there in early morning and late afternoon. Furthermore, Commuting and Splitting lane should be avoid, if I might suggest. I, myself, commute and while on the freeway and the traffic is heavy, i would ditch it and go local, you should be able to make it there faster. Saving gas but also saving your butt...keep the shiny side up, rubber side down buddy.

GwarHawk said:

I was lane splitting on my way to work this morning. A bit ahead two cars almost merged into each other. I started a hard brake when the back wheel just went out from under me. Guessing I hit some oil as I'm used to the paint being slick but it's hard to know.

I'm ok, and the bike is still ride-able (more or less). The cager behind me stopped helped me get my bike up and waited with me until I could go. I'm thankful for his help and I'm thankful he didn't run me over.

you all stay safe.

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How would you describe your normal, day-to-day braking technique? Do you normally use more front brake than the rear, or more rear than front?

How far were you from the cars that you describe? What was your speed relative to theirs?

thuc said:

just a little advice I got from my much more experienced buddies...commuting on bike is something not so good itself, since your senses and the cagers' senses are not all there in early morning and late afternoon. Furthermore, Commuting and Splitting lane should be avoid, if I might suggest. I, myself, commute and while on the freeway and the traffic is heavy, i would ditch it and go local, you should be able to make it there faster. Saving gas but also saving your butt...keep the shiny side up, rubber side down buddy.

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A very similar crash could have taken place on surface streets as well. What skill or technique could you share that might help him?

Enchanter said:

How would you describe your normal, day-to-day braking technique? Do you normally use more front brake than the rear, or more rear than front?

How far were you from the cars that you describe? What was your speed relative to theirs?

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These questions are important. OP, if you answer them you can learn something and avoid this situation again.

Remember: Anybody can ride a motorcycle. Unfortunately that convinces us that we actually know what we are doing.

I wouldn't be the one to go to for skills or techniques, but if I would have a choice, I wouldn't split lane while commuting, other than that...look further ahead, not only on bike, but even on car, try to anticipate what will happen before it actually happens

thuc said:

I wouldn't be the one to go to for skills or techniques, but if I would have a choice, I wouldn't split lane while commuting, other than that...look further ahead, not only on bike, but even on car, try to anticipate what will happen before it actually happens

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Excellent point--this is a judgement call that would have avoided the entire incident but dealing with the actual event can be a enlightening experience for everyone.

I'm curious to speed and situation as well. I would think that complacency could be a real issue. If you travel the same path a lot then you 'get used to it' and you start expecting the same thing everyday and when suddenly things go south you have a startle response and over brake.

When lane splitting you must be wide awake and ready for everything. Not that long ago I was splitting between the #1 & #2 lane when I came upon a white service truck in the #1 lane. I could see the driver look directly at me through his large mirror and as I approached at 20 miles an hour (he was in stop and go) he swerved into the #2 lane. I luckily was awake enough and didn't blink at the wrong time and was able to swerve behind him and pass him on the drivers side popping out in front of him. It was a violent action but it worked.
With that said, I've practiced emergency lane changes and braking and everyone that rides should too.
As many have said the front brake provides 85% of your stopping power and the rear the rest. Applying the brakes is an art that most cyclist are trying to improve on a regular basis. I don't profess to be all that skilled but I have found that the front brake must be applied in a progressive manner. As it is applied and weight transfers forward it can be applied harder and harder right up to the point that the tire starts to skid. Of course this all happens in a fraction of a second and it is hard not to panic and just grab a handful.
I suggest picking up a book on improving your skills and practicing Braking techniques. It will really help calm your nerves and reduce your stopping distance.

So glad you are ok!

Practice emergency braking. You want to learn to brake hard (front and rear) without locking up either wheel. Developing that skill really makes a difference in keeping yourself safe. I find myself needing to stop quickly every few weeks, for idiot drivers, for lights that change sooner than expected. Having the confidence that practice gave me along with the skill means I keep a cool head in potentially bad situations.

GwarHawk said:

I was lane splitting on my way to work this morning. A bit ahead two cars almost merged into each other. I started a hard brake when the back wheel just went out from under me. Guessing I hit some oil as I'm used to the paint being slick but it's hard to know.

I'm ok, and the bike is still ride-able (more or less). The cager behind me stopped helped me get my bike up and waited with me until I could go. I'm thankful for his help and I'm thankful he didn't run me over.

you all stay safe.

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It sounds like maybe you are relying or even exclusively using your rear brake? Without knowing, I would guess that you did NOT hit any oil, but just that it felt like you did (probability here).

If you lock the rear, it will fishtail and maybe slide out.

thuc said:

just a little advice I got from my much more experienced buddies...commuting on bike is something not so good itself, since your senses and the cagers' senses are not all there in early morning and late afternoon. Furthermore, Commuting and Splitting lane should be avoid, if I might suggest. I, myself, commute and while on the freeway and the traffic is heavy, i would ditch it and go local, you should be able to make it there faster. Saving gas but also saving your butt...keep the shiny side up, rubber side down buddy.

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I'm guessing you mean well, but this is not helpful advice. Or let's say, it is as helpful as saying "don't ride, it's the safest method of motorcycling."

Plenty of us split aggressively on a daily basis. It is all about awareness and being prepared for the worst.

jdhu said:

I'm guessing you mean well, but this is not helpful advice. Or let's say, it is as helpful as saying "don't ride, it's the safest method of motorcycling."

Plenty of us split aggressively on a daily basis. It is all about awareness and being prepared for the worst.

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Riding and splitting lanes has nothing to do with each other, it's like eating at InandOut, a lot of people like them, but not all of them will choose to have grilled onion on their burgers. I didn't mean to say NO to lane splitting. I, myself, split lanes more often than not, but I choose to do it while I'm out having joy rides with buds, AND choose not to do it at 7AM on weekdays going to work. It's a personal choice, but my point is, if you're gonna ride fast and aggressive then be safe and have fun while not making the biker reputation to the rest of the world any worse.

thuc,

You stated your not one to go to for skills & technique so you should just stay out of the thread instead of some smart ass remark like don't ride during commute hours. Thats like telling treyvon martins parents that their kid got killed cuz he went for skittles at night and that he would have lived if he went for skittles in the morning. Don't be THAT guy dude, have some tact.

thuc said:

Riding and splitting lanes has nothing to do with each other, it's like eating at InandOut, a lot of people like them, but not all of them will choose to have grilled onion on their burgers. I didn't mean to say NO to lane splitting. I, myself, split lanes more often than not, but I choose to do it while I'm out having joy rides with buds, AND choose not to do it at 7AM on weekdays going to work. It's a personal choice, but my point is, if you're gonna ride fast and aggressive then be safe and have fun while not making the biker reputation to the rest of the world any worse.

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I completely disagree, and well, this is a crash analysis thread, so we should focus on the specific, technical reasons for the crash (for example, overusing the rear brake). OP's situation could (and does) occur at anytime of day, during any level of traffic.

Your "advice" really doesn't address that. To take your input further, the best way to avoid crashes is to not ride, correct?

Wow, I had no idea I'd start such a energetic discussion. I mostly wanted to post to say: I crashed, I didn't die, and I'm glad.

re: commuting and lane splitting: I've been riding bikes on the street for 30 years now, many of them when I lived in LA and my motorcycle was my only vehicle. Now days I tend to take BART more often, when it is an option for me. I agree lane-splitting has its risks and they are higher in commute traffic than other times, but sometimes it is how I get to work.

In terms of my braking technique, I believe I balance my braking between front and rear based on speed and road conditions.

Now that the adrenaline has subsided and I've pondered it a bit, I'm pretty sure I got clipped from behind. There was none of the drift that I'd expect from the back tire just breaking loose; I was breaking, then, BAM! I was on the ground. Also, the geometry of how I went down and the bike was thrown out in front of me is just wrong for a regular low side. I don't think I'll ever know for sure.

I'm a lucky guy. I was wearing good gear and it did it's job. I'm ok, and my bike isn't a whole lot uglier than it was before.

I appreciate the well wishes, and the thoughts on what can be learnt from the experience.

You all have a great day,

GwarHawk said:

Wow, I had no idea I'd start such a energetic discussion. I mostly wanted to post to say: I crashed, I didn't die, and I'm glad.

re: commuting and lane splitting: I've been riding bikes on the street for 30 years now, many of them when I lived in LA and my motorcycle was my only vehicle. Now days I tend to take BART more often, when it is an option for me. I agree lane-splitting has its risks and they are higher in commute traffic than other times, but sometimes it is how I get to work.

In terms of my braking technique, I believe I balance my braking between front and rear based on speed and road conditions.

Now that the adrenaline has subsided and I've pondered it a bit, I'm pretty sure I got clipped from behind. There was none of the drift that I'd expect from the back tire just breaking loose; I was breaking, then, BAM! I was on the ground. Also, the geometry of how I went down and the bike was thrown out in front of me is just wrong for a regular low side. I don't think I'll ever know for sure.

I'm a lucky guy. I was wearing good gear and it did it's job. I'm ok, and my bike isn't a whole lot uglier than it was before.

I appreciate the well wishes, and the thoughts on what can be learnt from the experience.

You all have a great day,

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From what you posted initially, it didn't seem like oil on the road. It seemed too sudden, so maybe getting clipped is more believable. Oil would most likely cause a quick, small slide, and that is all (since you were straight up at the time).

When you say "balanced" between front and rear, does that (hopefully) mean 90% front (or more)?

GwarHawk said:

Now that the adrenaline has subsided and I've pondered it a bit, I'm pretty sure I got clipped from behind. There was none of the drift that I'd expect from the back tire just breaking loose; I was breaking, then, BAM! I was on the ground. Also, the geometry of how I went down and the bike was thrown out in front of me is just wrong for a regular low side. I don't think I'll ever know for sure.

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I would agree that rear wheel skids are generally easier to feel. I would also think that if you were hit by another vehicle, you would have felt that as well.

What you are describing sounds exactly like a lowside caused from locking the front brake.

Yup, tucking the front due to a skid will pitch you over the nose.

What was your speed and the speed of traffic?

sfrepsol said:

thuc,

You stated your not one to go to for skills & technique so you should just stay out of the thread instead of some smart ass remark like don't ride during commute hours. Thats like telling treyvon martins parents that their kid got killed cuz he went for skittles at night and that he would have lived if he went for skittles in the morning. Don't be THAT guy dude, have some tact.

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Do you read? When did I say to stay out of commute hours? When was advice considered skills & techniques??? and you just have to bring up a sad story about the Martins to make yourself feel smart...

For the OP, he knows what he's doing, and I hope when this thread is read by some new comer, they would go upon my posts and think about it. Don't be all robotic on things sometimes...it's not modern warfare...it's life...you don't get to re-spawn

Thuc, you're new here and unfamiliar with the theme of the Crash Analysis Forum. Please take some time to become familiar with the rules regarding posting here.

We focus on the specific elements of the crash and what we can do to avoid a similar situation in the future. Suggesting to avoid lane-sharing really doesn't address what the rider dd to cause this crash. I tried hinting at what we look for here (skills/techniques) and I think it went un-noticed. Several others attempted it too.

Poke around in some of the other threads in this forum, and you should get a better idea of what we are looking for here.

Thanks!