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Old 11-23-2016, 08:39 AM   #46
Maddevill
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My friend's girlfriend took the CMSP course over a weekend. Got her M1, then went to a Z2 trackday on the next Monday. Had a blast. Took 2 more trackdays with good results including one rather tame lowside. She still hasn't ridden street yet but is learning tons and having fun.
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Old 11-23-2016, 09:48 AM   #47
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My friend's girlfriend took the CMSP course over a weekend. Got her M1, then went to a Z2 trackday on the next Monday. Had a blast. Took 2 more trackdays with good results including one rather tame lowside. She still hasn't ridden street yet but is learning tons and having fun.
Shoutout to Z2 Roadrider 2.0!

RIP my 250
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Old 11-23-2016, 10:32 AM   #48
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Aww quit yer bitchin. The 250 is alive and well, and still dragging your ass around the track.
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Old 11-23-2016, 10:43 AM   #49
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And on Sunday I'll be throwing it around T hill backwards
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Old 11-23-2016, 11:59 AM   #50
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the learning curve is a life long adventure.
heck should see what i must go through each year just to keep my commercial drivers permit. and i have been at this for 35 years.

but do not fear the parking lot school. is there a large empty lot close to where you live?

grab a bunch of large "beer" cups and rocks to fit. (wind thing). use them as cones and have fun, away from everything.
then keep to back roads. away from heavy traffic. (i know hard to do in the bay area) plan time early sunday am.

there is/was a school over in hayward/union city area. they do far more then just the basic classes on riding. sorry i forget there name. been a number of years. yes schooling and training cost $$$$. and they supply the bikes so dropping a bike will not cost you any cash.

good luck, keep your mind on the ride, and be safe.

got proper gear?


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Old 12-07-2016, 11:49 AM   #51
kelee
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As a person who just finished the CMSP and also someone who's taken another riding school's course in Canada, I feel like I can comment on the pros and cons of the CMSP course in a comparative manner.

In a nutshell, the CMSP course is short but sweet. It doesn't provide street time and doesn't give new riders experience on what's going to happen to them on the road. What it does provide is a good understanding of what might/could happen through theory, as well as the basic experience of riding a motorcycle in a parking lot. Compared to my other course I've done outside of the US, I paid close to $750 for it compared to the ~$200 for the CMSP course. However, it included 15 hours of theory, 15 hours of lot time, as well as two street rides in areas like downtown core, around mountain roads, and on highways. As you can see, the course is much longer and provide much more riding time/experience compared to the CMSP course. However, the theory I received from both course is very similar. I think the biggest differentiation between someone who has taken the CMSP course versus someone who hasn't is the MINDSET that CMSP course installs into the new rider. Skills can be learned afterwards, but starting the first step with the right mindset will help shape the rider to be much more aware of their choice to ride and their judgement when they ride.

I think in general, both the CMSP course and the DMV exam are too laxed of a test to determine if a rider is "sufficient" to receive their full license. In my own experience back where I'm from, the DMV equivalent requires new riders to pass a written test, then a parking lot test (which can also be waived through an accredited school course), as well as an "on road" test similar to getting a car license (the tester follows your motorcycle in a car and gives directions through a radio device).

It baffles my mind as to how riders here can be riding an R1 or 1000rr immediately after passing a parking lot test in a scooter... but that's what Darwin's theory is for.

Last edited by kelee; 12-07-2016 at 11:53 AM..
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Old 12-07-2016, 04:28 PM   #52
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Lol someone is censoring us. I made a comment on why the US is so lax on licensing requirements and it was deleted
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Old 12-07-2016, 06:36 PM   #53
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Your post was sent to the PW thread where it was a better fit.

And let's be honest here, your post was hardly a comment on "why the US is so lax on licensing requirements".

There are a few forums we like to keep focused on the topic at hand. Post whoring is not supposed to take place in the General Forum. It is not accepted at all in Riding Skills, Crash Analysis, and LEO.

Observation: More than a few Mods have observed that your posts are, well, sort of empty and off topic, more akin to PWing. One only has to look at this thread to observe it. We would like you to make some adjustments when it comes to posting in other forums. Basically, the Kitchen Sink is the only place where we generally overlook PWing. At this point, this is a suggestion / advice. It could easily turn into a formal request (mandatory). It's completely up to you.

If you would like to continue this discussion, start a thread in Website / Geek Speak. Do not continue it here.
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Old 12-13-2016, 12:15 PM   #54
stephanotis
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DMV Skills Test

So. Since I failed the CMSP skills test by one freaking point in September, and I couldn't get my bike and myself over to the SF City College range within 2 months to redo it, I am taking the CA DMV skills test on Friday.

For those of you not familiar with it, I have attached a description (from the CA DMV Handbook) (CA = California, not Canada, ha).

I drew that goddamned circle on a nearby parking lot with chalk and practiced. And practiced. And researched online how to get around it. It's seriously tough and I haven't even actually done it yet, which is good. That means I need more practice!

That said, I sent this to my rider friend in the UK and she said the same thing: So damn easy!

Anyway, regardless of the cultural differences, I do agree it should be even harder if we are putting people on motorcycles on streets and freeways. With passengers. At night. Just sayin'.
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Old 12-13-2016, 12:23 PM   #55
Maddevill
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I rode for about 10 years without an M1, and bought and sold and registered many bikes through my local DMV. Finally took the skills test...on an 86 GSXR750. I couldn't keep the stupid bike inside that circle without dabbing... a lot. The lady who was watching was one if the clerks who had helped me with several bikes. She just said " I know you can ride. You pass".
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Old 12-13-2016, 12:28 PM   #56
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Ha! What finally convinced you to go in and pass the test?
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Old 12-13-2016, 01:06 PM   #57
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Ha! What finally convinced you to go in and pass the test?
I have had a couple of students over the years that were in class to get their M1 because their bikes got impounded when they got caught riding without a license and they said they could not get the bike out of impound without having their license. Since impound charges a hefty "storage" fee for every day the bike is in "storage" they wanted their license quickly.

But not having your bike impounded is a pretty good reason for getting your license.

There are several ways to ride the DMV "keyhole".

One way is to increase the engine revs to about 2500-3k rpm, slip the clutch (friction zone), apply a little rear brake pressure to drag the rear brake, counterweight (push your shoulders to the outside of the turn) and turn your head at least 90 degrees ahead in the path of travel and keeping your eyes at the horizon level.

Turning your head tells you where you are going.

Keeping your eyes up at the horizon level aids in your balance.

Counterweighting allows the bike to be more easily balanced at slower speed.

Spinning the engine up gives you more balance/stability as the gyroscopic effect of the spinning crankshaft is increased as engine speed increases.

Dragging the rear brake gives you a more constant drag to work against and then you modulate the clutch in the friction zone to keep the bike always pulling forward (never pull the clutch all the way in).

Slipping the clutch in the friction zone allows you to ride the bike at speed less than first gear at idle and also gives you a lot smoother control of your speed (for more speed ease out the clutch slightly (1/4"), for less speed squeeze the clutch in slightly (1/4")) than the throttle will allow at those speeds.

Go practice all of that and you will have the key hole down in about 10-15 minutes or practice.

I suggest practicing slipping the clutch and controlling the speed with the clutch and rear brake in a 50-100' straight line first.

Then a straight line and add in head turn and a 90 degree turn

Then repeat adding counterweighting a few times

Then repeat through a 180 degree turn

Then repeat through a full circle and even a figure 8
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Old 12-13-2016, 01:28 PM   #58
Maddevill
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Ha! What finally convinced you to go in and pass the test?
I think I just got paranoid about getting impounded. But I was pulled over at least 3 times and they didn't say a word about my lack of M1...
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Old 12-13-2016, 01:29 PM   #59
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I think I just got paranoid about getting impounded. But I was pulled over at least 3 times and they didn't say a word about my lack of M1...
Cause you look like Santa Claus
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Old 12-13-2016, 03:18 PM   #60
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George, that's GREAT advice, thank you!

Steve, you obviously have lots of luck to spare, please send some my way!
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