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Old 10-30-2018, 03:53 PM   #1
RRrider
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Will cc specs for AFM classes change in 2019?

there are a bunch of new bikes coming out (e.g. the ninja 400, and the much anticipated Daytona 765RS which presumably will be based upon Triumph's Moto2 experience next year) which don't fit into the present AFM bike classes.

Does anyone know if the class definitions will be updated? of if for example, the present rules will persist and the 765 RS will be in the same class at the Ducati V4S...which feels, shall we say, wrong to me?

thanks
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Old 11-01-2018, 07:32 AM   #2
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765 RS you say? There hasn't been one word on the internets about this other than a bunch of Daytona diehards throwing it around, so I'm not so sure on the 2019 release.

I know the 400 has been a hot topic for the last couple months at the board meetings. TBD on what will happen.
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Old 11-01-2018, 09:09 AM   #3
eeeeek
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RRrider View Post
there are a bunch of new bikes coming out (e.g. the ninja 400, and the much anticipated Daytona 765RS which presumably will be based upon Triumph's Moto2 experience next year) which don't fit into the present AFM bike classes.

Does anyone know if the class definitions will be updated? of if for example, the present rules will persist and the 765 RS will be in the same class at the Ducati V4S...which feels, shall we say, wrong to me?

thanks
The rules will have a higher likelyhood of changing if someone (hint) proposes a rule change.
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Old 11-01-2018, 09:15 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by RRrider View Post
there are a bunch of new bikes coming out (e.g. the ninja 400, and the much anticipated Daytona 765RS which presumably will be based upon Triumph's Moto2 experience next year) which don't fit into the present AFM bike classes.
I've been wondering about the Ninja 400 (399cc water-cooled, street-based, 4-stroke twin) since I rented one for the Sonoma round this year. Rulebook specifically says "Currently the Ninja 400 is not eligible to run in AFM." However, it seems to fit just fine into existing classes:

Formula III: 100-400cc 4-stroke street based twins
Fomula Twins LW: 245-500cc 4-stroke twin cylinder, NA
250 SBK: 175-250cc; next class up is 251-450cc, but twins can run down a class as long as they are within 250cc displacement advantage (so a 400 twin is OK)
350 Superstock: 251-350cc, twins can run down a class limited to 250cc displacement advantage
Clubman LW

I'm wondering if I'm misinterpreting any of these classing rules... seems like they just need to get rid of the "Ninja 400s not eligible" line.
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Old 11-01-2018, 10:21 AM   #5
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As with every other racing organization, you should also be mindful of any technical bulletins that are announced throughout the year. Last years TB indicated what the 400 would be eligible for at the beginning of the season as other race organizatons also assessed what and where the 400 would be able to fit in. MotoAmerica in and of itself struggled with the 400 and the KTM 390 all year and had technical bulletin releases on just the Jr. Cup almost every round trying to find a competitive standard for all makes.

We (AFM) are currently actively working with the manufacturers and the members to seek a collective agreement that checks the most boxes for the club and it's members in not only the entry level classes, but also the 600, 700 Twins and Open bikes.

I don't believe there will be big changes to structure but more so clarifications based on better understandings of what the models are being released and how they fit within the AFM structure and spirit of amateur racing...as well as ensuring we can get contingency for those so capable or inclined.
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Old 11-02-2018, 12:04 PM   #6
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As with every other racing organization, you should also be mindful of any technical bulletins that are announced throughout the year. Last years TB indicated what the 400 would be eligible for at the beginning of the season as other race organizatons also assessed what and where the 400 would be able to fit in. MotoAmerica in and of itself struggled with the 400 and the KTM 390 all year and had technical bulletin releases on just the Jr. Cup almost every round trying to find a competitive standard for all makes.

We (AFM) are currently actively working with the manufacturers and the members to seek a collective agreement that checks the most boxes for the club and it's members in not only the entry level classes, but also the 600, 700 Twins and Open bikes.

I don't believe there will be big changes to structure but more so clarifications based on better understandings of what the models are being released and how they fit within the AFM structure and spirit of amateur racing...as well as ensuring we can get contingency for those so capable or inclined.
Ah, cool, found it:

400 Ninja will be eligible to run in the following classes:
Lightweight Twins
450 Super Stock
450 Superbike
Formula III


Eric, I'm not familiar with what goes into creating the different classes and eligibility rules... could you share any of what went into the decision to put the 400 twins with 450 cripple triples, instead of letting them run down a class like the rules allow as originally written? Seems like if it was thought that the 400s would have had too much of an advantage in the lower classes, the issue is with the classing rules, not with that particular model of bike, no?
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Old 11-02-2018, 12:37 PM   #7
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Jeez, it's not going to do well in 450 against criple triples or twins against SV650/FZ07.

I think all manufacturers need to go back to the 450's for the small SS bikes (Ninja, R3, CBR etc). there're already racing classes set up and its a sweet spot for power.
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Old 11-02-2018, 07:15 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by sckego View Post
Ah, cool, found it:

400 Ninja will be eligible to run in the following classes:
Lightweight Twins
450 Super Stock
450 Superbike
Formula III


Eric, I'm not familiar with what goes into creating the different classes and eligibility rules... could you share any of what went into the decision to put the 400 twins with 450 cripple triples, instead of letting them run down a class like the rules allow as originally written? Seems like if it was thought that the 400s would have had too much of an advantage in the lower classes, the issue is with the classing rules, not with that particular model of bike, no?
If lower classes are for 2 cylinder bikes run down rule does not apply.
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Old 11-03-2018, 07:29 AM   #9
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If lower classes are for 2 cylinder bikes run down rule does not apply.
Does that apply to the run-down classes I listed (350 superstock, 250 superbike)? I don't see any mention of those being for two cylinder bikes. The only superstock/superbike class that is explicitly called out as for twins is "600-700cc twin cylinder motorcycles."
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Old 11-03-2018, 08:57 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by sckego View Post
Does that apply to the run-down classes I listed (350 superstock, 250 superbike)? I don't see any mention of those being for two cylinder bikes. The only superstock/superbike class that is explicitly called out as for twins is "600-700cc twin cylinder motorcycles."
Not according to rule book (online one). I don't see it either. 250 used to be twins and protected from run down rule.
As is written ninja 400 is excluded from 300 world ss class only.
Unless there is TB (don't see it in rule book) to override rule book.
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