Why does the SV650 sound so much better than the Ninja 650?

[davidji]

A standard parallel twin fires every 360 degrees.

Both 360-degree and 180-degree parallel twins are pretty standard. Both the parallel twins I've had have had 180-degree cranks.

180-degree twins like the Ninja 650r tend to be higher revving than 360-degree engines, and have a lumpier idle. I think the lumpy idle of the 650r sounds great.

Coolest sounding parallel twin I've ridden? Ace Motorsports' Triumph Scrambler demo bike, with it's 270-degree crank, and Arrow exhaust. Too loud for me though.

 

[Aluisious]

This v-twin sound makes me drool.

[youtube]i1GTBPFfG40[/youtube]

 

[Kestrel]

Older ones are a deal. Don't necessarily get hung up on buying new. They're cheap, and pretty damned reliable. Few weak points, as others have pointed out (brakes and suspension), but those are easily fixed. Love the shit out of mine, to be honest.

 

[flying_hun]

Yamaha TDM850 IIRC.

The first generation did not, but the subsequent generations (not imported to the US) did.

 

[Kestrel]

I'm gettin' all worked up over here...I get all worked up about potential bikes frequently but the SV is so darn sensible and affordable it'd be hard not to pull the trigger on a good deal.

You know what, that's the thing.. I've ridden a lot of other bikes, and I've thought a lot about purchasing something else... But for the most part, I just can't justify it, no matter which way I swing it. I do want a dual sport for gravel stuff, but for most street riding, it's hard to knock. It is literally one of the best bang for the buck bikes in existence. I cannot bring myself to sell the thing. I've ridden a shit ton of different bikes, and though I might have temporarily been envious of one aspect or another, none of them gave me the overall enjoyment that beating the shit out of my SV does. Drag knee on the way to work. Jump the railroad tracks on the way home. It is a sweetheart of a bike, and while it isn't necessarily the most fast thing out there, I rarely feel "outgunned" when the twisties get nasty. There's something about the engine in that thing that just makes it fun as piss to ride.

 

[MysterYvil]

I noticed a few bikes in traffic last week that sounded really sweet...and saw they were SV650s. Apparently in years of riding every 650 I've heard had the sewing machine exhaust installed and I didn't realize they had a really sweet twin sound.

This made me look into buying an SV650 (already a fan of the ergos etc). Problem is you can't get one new anymore, and I'm not so keen on inheriting the result of someone else's crashes, "drops," lack of maintenance, etc. So I looked into the Ninja 650...but every video I've seen of them makes them sound like angry 250s. What's the big difference?

Is it the cat? V vs parallel twin? Some other bit of engine tech?

<Salas patois>

Why you wanna be makin' noise, bro!?

I can hammer the shit outta my Green Hornet in front of the popo, and unless he be watchin', he don't even look up from his cellie or latte!

</Salas Patois>

(And yup, it fact it's the difference between a parallel twin and a V-twin)

And for my "Cool story, bro" moment: I was on a ride with a bunch of HD dudes last summer, and one of them couldn't find my muffler, said my moto made no noise at all... I told them that Kawk had made the perfect perpetual motion device, no petrol needed, and left it at that...

 

[joespeedfast]

I'd need some serious proof it is a better bike.

FWIW:

There were originally two basic SV models, Naked and S faired. Both gen one and get two. When the Gladius came out it displaced the Naked bike.

It is much heavier, clunkier and nobody in their right mind would race one. It does have some trick bits and pieces like single valve springs.

Also, the SV is like 67 degrees, not ninety.

"Better" may be somewhat subjective but here's a few reasons.
• Cylinders receive racing-derived SCEM (Suzuki Composite Eletrochemical Material) for better heat dissipation, reduced friction, etc.
• 5% increase in crankshaft inertia enhances low-to-mid range output and “highlights power-pulse feel.”
• Single spring per valve versus the SV650’s two springs per valve reduces inertia weight, and thereby mechanical losses.
• High-lift cam for increased torque.
• Throttle body intake funnels, though longer than what the SV650 used, are two different lengths for improved mid-range.
• Idle Speed Control (ISC) system integrated into throttle body –first ever on any Suzuki street bike– improves idle, cold starting and eliminates additional wiring and hoses. The same 10-hole fuel injectors used on the GSX-R600 and 750 offer better atomization of fuel mixture. Two Iridium-tip spark plugs per cylinder complete the package for more thorough, consistent combustion which in turn is claimed to lead to better economy, emissions, power, etc.
• All new compact exhaust with mid-chamber is claimed to increase low and mid-range torque while different length exhaust pipes allegedly improve low-end performance; exhaust design also contributes to lower CoG.
• New radiator is smaller; oil cooler is now liquid-to-liquid rather than air-cooled, and its new design helps centralize mass.

It's extra weight is mostly stock exhaust, plus I like the steel trellis frame.
You racer-dudes can't seem to stop with teh mods anyhow.
I still like the last gen SF or first gen naked best, but the new bike ain't all bad.
I like this one. Looks close to stock and still has a lot of "extra" weight to take off.

 

[greener]

Admit it, there's only one two cylinder motorcycle that sounds worse than a kawasaki

Uh, did you make to :20 of that vid?

 

[greener]

I like how the Leo Vince SBK exhaust sounds on a SV.

Sound check fail. You can't guage the sound when you're recording inside a concrete box of a dyno shop.
There's a reason everyone sounds good singing in the shower... same effect here

 

[dubels]

My husband's 65-year-old mother has two SV650s, one that she's put 90,000 miles on, and another that she raced in Run What You Brung at Bonneville last year.

Now that is cool

 

[ScottRNelson]

The V-angle makes a big difference in how good a twin cylinder motorcycle engine sounds. Ducatis and Moto Guzzis use 90 degrees and sound great. The Suzuki SV and TL engines are also 90 degrees, not 67.

The KTM LC8 engine (like in my bike) is 75 degrees and doesn't feel (more vibration) or sound as good as a 90 degree V-twin, but has other advantages like being more compact. There are cruisers with 50-degree and 60 or 65-degree engines that don't sound quite as good as the Harley 45-degree engine, which also sounds "right".

The Triumph Thunderbird 1600cc engine is a parallel twin with a 270 degree crankshaft that sounds very much like a 90 degree V-twin and sounds good to my ears. For some reason the other Triumph parallel twins don't sound quite as good to me, regardless of the crankshaft offset, although I haven't spent much time listening to them to be sure. I would love to have some sort of sporting machine that uses the Thunderbird engine with its huge amounts of smooth power, if they could make it weigh less than 500 pounds and have some decent cornering clearance.

And for completeness, here's a video I took at Ace Motorsports a few years back when they had demo rides and a free dyno run. It's a Monster S4RS that registered about 145 hp on the dyno:
http://s25.photobucket.com/albums/c.../?action=view&current=145hpMonsterDynoRun.mp4

I would embed this, if I could figure out how.

 

[Roadstergal]

There's a reason everyone sounds good singing in the shower...

I don't. I have to bring the sixfiddy into the shower to drown out the noise if I'm going to sing.

 

[planegray]

Uh, did you make to :20 of that vid?

I agree it sounds BETTER, but ( to ME ) it's still a "ho hum" parallel twin....it's not you..it's me ( I think my years of beating ye olde Honda 160 forever ruined me )

 

[MC BumSlap]

Define "kinda for sale"

I'm 50/50 on selling it. But sell it to pay off some bills...then what? Have no ride when the weather gets better. Eh....

I heart a Triumph Street Triple 675R

 

[Junkie]

"Better" may be somewhat subjective but here's a few reasons.
• Cylinders receive racing-derived SCEM (Suzuki Composite Eletrochemical Material) for better heat dissipation, reduced friction, etc.
• 5% increase in crankshaft inertia enhances low-to-mid range output and “highlights power-pulse feel.”
• Single spring per valve versus the SV650’s two springs per valve reduces inertia weight, and thereby mechanical losses.
• High-lift cam for increased torque.
• Throttle body intake funnels, though longer than what the SV650 used, are two different lengths for improved mid-range.
• Idle Speed Control (ISC) system integrated into throttle body –first ever on any Suzuki street bike– improves idle, cold starting and eliminates additional wiring and hoses. The same 10-hole fuel injectors used on the GSX-R600 and 750 offer better atomization of fuel mixture. Two Iridium-tip spark plugs per cylinder complete the package for more thorough, consistent combustion which in turn is claimed to lead to better economy, emissions, power, etc.
• All new compact exhaust with mid-chamber is claimed to increase low and mid-range torque while different length exhaust pipes allegedly improve low-end performance; exhaust design also contributes to lower CoG.
• New radiator is smaller; oil cooler is now liquid-to-liquid rather than air-cooled, and its new design helps centralize mass.

It's extra weight is mostly stock exhaust, plus I like the steel trellis frame.
You racer-dudes can't seem to stop with teh mods anyhow.
I still like the last gen SF or first gen naked best, but the new bike ain't all bad.
I like this one. Looks close to stock and still has a lot of "extra" weight to take off.

To me, the things there that matter:
the new cylinders are a little bit lighter, and last forever. that's good.
the heavier crank makes it slower to rev, and claiming increased bottom end and midrange means that top end is likely decreased.
single valve springs? sure, sounds good.
higher lift in cams tends to increase top end, not torque much... and as with above, "increased torque" often means less top end
same as above for the velocity stacks, although less of a big deal
smaller radiator is nice as long as it doesn't overheat

but overall, sounds to me like most of the engine is a downgrade. you can, however, build a hybrid sv/sfv engine with the good parts from each.

 

[JPK]

I'm generally a fan of quieter bikes also, but the sewing machine sound of my Ninja 650 was, well... lame. I put an Arrow Dark can on the bike (with the db killer) and it made all the difference. Even with the db killer it's still a bit loud for my taste, and I'm not crazy about losing the catalytic converter, but it makes me giggle every time it lets out a nasty pop when I downshift and the sounds that emanate from that can are soooo nice compared to that anemic buzz I used to get. I should get around to plugging the PAIR valve to kill the popping, but that exhaust made the bike 10x funner to ride.

 

[Z3n]

I'm still idly considering building up another Gen 1 bike. Couple of reasons: You could buy 3 or 4 of them for the price of a new SV650S, you can do the cam swap for an awesome lumpy idle and a good increase in power, flatslides can be found cheap sometimes for an excellent gain in power and throttle response, and they take well to a lot of different mods.

The engine's already bulletproof, I had one that fragged the transmission after 140k, including 2 seasons of trackdays and 2 seasons of racing. Engine still ran fine, the transmission just left all it's teeth on the oilpan.

 

[GAJ]

ummm, not sure how much it matters, but that IS a picture of the gen1 SV. the gen 2 SV is the more angular one.

FWIW, the difference between the two is mostly the aesthetics and the 2nd gen bikes are fuel injected while the 1st gens are carbed. the gen 2 is supposed to have better performance, but it's supposedly pretty slight. some people say the FI is a bit clumsy, but some people say the carbed bike ain't any better.

Sorry about that; couldn't grab a picture from the Suzuki website so googled it up and, evidently, screwed it up!

Thanks for the catch; 2009's are, however, available from the dealer in the S model.

 

[Aluisious]

I'm 50/50 on selling it. But sell it to pay off some bills...then what? Have no ride when the weather gets better. Eh....

I heart a Triumph Street Triple 675R

Sell it, pay bills, work hard, get money, buy new bike you want.

 

[thesnaf]

why does the SV650 sound so much better thant he ninja?

Because the SV is the best bike EVER!