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Dorna & Wayne Rainey to Develop NA Racing Leauge?

I hope this is not another cookie cutter, biased endeavor like the MotoGP series has become. You don't need to compete in Moto3 to ride a MotoGP bike. Roberts, Rainey, Spencer, Spies, and on and on, have proved that.

If, big if, Dorna took over AMA from the Florida Freaks, would it be better, or just look like CEV? The AMA was a good series. The older version was even better. The formats suited the U.S.. Does a Moto3-MotoGP style American format really work? In the seventies, maybe. Today, I am not so sure.

Then there is the question of France's DMG actually selling rights to the AMA pro-racing and whether AMA would do that. You have an organization (DMG) with big egos that may ask too much. We could end-up with another mess, just like CART and INDY-CAR, because of Tony George's big ego.

I will hang my hopes on Wayne. He is a good man, and needs things to do. He should get Kenny off the golf course and running another team, too. :teeth
 
It would be so much better if they took over the AMA rather than start something new to compete with the AMA.

AMA could "recover" with Dorna backing and some time.
 
clutchslip said:
I hope this is not another cookie cutter, biased endeavor like the MotoGP series has become. You don't need to compete in Moto3 to ride a MotoGP bike. Roberts, Rainey, Spencer, Spies, and on and on, have proved that.

If, big if, Dorna took over AMA from the Florida Freaks, would it be better, or just look like CEV? The AMA was a good series. The older version was even better. The formats suited the U.S.. Does a Moto3-MotoGP style American format really work? In the seventies, maybe. Today, I am not so sure.

Then there is the question of France's DMG actually selling rights to the AMA pro-racing and whether AMA would do that. You have an organization (DMG) with big egos that may ask too much. We could end-up with another mess, just like CART and INDY-CAR, because of Tony George's big ego.

I will hang my hopes on Wayne. He is a good man, and needs things to do. He should get Kenny off the golf course and running another team, too. :teeth
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Well said...:thumbup
 
I think the biggest boost with DORNA backing is giving confidence to riders who participate that if they do well in the new US series, they have a legitimate pipeline into racing in Europe and Moto2/3.

Look at Asia's Shell Advance Cup, Dorna provides feeder slots for riders into Moto3 and Moto2. Spanish CEV is also pretty much a feeder to Moto3. Hopefully some sort of arrangement can be made for their efforts in the states. Right now AMA is overpriced club racing, unless you bring serious money nobody is going to notice you here.
 
clutchslip said:
I hope this is not another cookie cutter, biased endeavor like the MotoGP series has become. You don't need to compete in Moto3 to ride a MotoGP bike. Roberts, Rainey, Spencer, Spies, and on and on, have proved that.

If, big if, Dorna took over AMA from the Florida Freaks, would it be better, or just look like CEV? The AMA was a good series. The older version was even better. The formats suited the U.S.. Does a Moto3-MotoGP style American format really work? In the seventies, maybe. Today, I am not so sure.

Then there is the question of France's DMG actually selling rights to the AMA pro-racing and whether AMA would do that. You have an organization (DMG) with big egos that may ask too much. We could end-up with another mess, just like CART and INDY-CAR, because of Tony George's big ego.

I will hang my hopes on Wayne. He is a good man, and needs things to do. He should get Kenny off the golf course and running another team, too. :teeth
Click to expand...

its not rly fair to bring up Roberts, Rainey, and Spencer as justification of why u dont need to ride Moto3 to compete in GP. their riding, their bikes, etc have nothing in common w/ GP today. todays SBKs have more in common w/ GP than their bikes, yet we know that SBK riders dont always do well in GP.

i do agree that Spies has shown us what u r saying. IMO, the #1 factor for getting him at GP-level talent was his competition w/ Mladin. that sort of competition is exactly why Moto3 and Moto2 riders can succeed in GP. if u win in the meat-grinder classes, u can compete in GP. i hear the competition in CEV is almost as tough. unfortunately, AMA just doesnt have it.

CEV is actually a good mix of GP and SBK competition. u essentially take the WSBK structure, add Moto3, and replace WSS w/ Moto2. u still get SBK, STK1000, and STK600. so it still works at a national level. perhaps Moto2 wont work over here just yet. but adding Moto3 would be more than helpful IMO. id be really happy w/ SBK, Moto2, STK600, and Moto3... pipedream i know.
 
stangmx13 said:
its not rly fair to bring up Roberts, Rainey, and Spencer as justification of why u dont need to ride Moto3 to compete in GP. their riding, their bikes, etc have nothing in common w/ GP today.
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Whoosh. What the heck are you talking about? The bikes then and now are irrelevant. There was an unofficial FIM system when they rode, too. How about Colin Edwards, Cal Crutchlow, etc. Are they better for you? Geez.

Roberts was the original Alien, btw. At least according the Europeans. No one is suppose to win without riding the tracks for at least a year. Luckily, Roberts gave a ride to Rainey, so he had a mediocre year in 250 to sort of see the tracks before he came back to the world scene. I'll edit my post another time to find names that might better illustrate my point for you....... Ugh. I wasn't even in the MotoGP thread.
 
I believe if it happens, there won't be competition with AMA, they will buy out AMA. There can only be one FIM sanctioned road racing series in America, from what was being discussed on the WERA forum.
 
I think the point is that AMA has degraded to a point where winning here is not impressive because the rest of the field lacks competition. The series itself is no longer that impressive to win. Herrin is helping us solidify that image but going into Moto2 as AMA champion and not even finishing races in Moto2.


Spies and Colin are irrelevant to today's situation. Its been over a decade since Spies started AMA...almost 15 years.:afm199. The series and the field are the same in name only.
 
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rob linders said:
I believe if it happens, there won't be competition with AMA, they will buy out AMA. There can only be one FIM sanctioned road racing series in America, from what was being discussed on the WERA forum.
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Aha and how do you know AMA's RR Sanctioning rights to DMG are for sale? You think This Guy gives 2 shits about people telling him what to do? How do you figure Dorna is going to approach this sale? I doubt saying "please sell us your AMA RR rights so we could run it better since we have more experience" will work.

And lastly how do you know people haven't already tried multiple times to acquire the series?
 
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clutchslip said:
Whoosh. What the heck are you talking about? The bikes then and now are irrelevant. There was an unofficial FIM system when they rode, too. How about Colin Edwards, Cal Crutchlow, etc. Are they better for you? Geez.

Roberts was the original Alien, btw. At least according the Europeans. No one is suppose to win without riding the tracks for at least a year. Luckily, Roberts gave a ride to Rainey, so he had a mediocre year in 250 to sort of see the tracks before he came back to the world scene. I'll edit my post another time to find names that might better illustrate my point for you....... Ugh. I wasn't even in the MotoGP thread.
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if u dont understand my point, u dont need to get your panties in a bunch. just ask. i wasnt disrespectful in my post.

the bikes are relevant. i also did say "their riding". "riding in GP", winning, takes a certain skill set on any bike. the skills required 30yrs ago are vastly different than today because the bikes are so different. because of that, Roberts' skills in his GP are worthless in todays competition. so him being GP's first alien doesnt support your idea one bit because no one will be racing 500s again.

Colin and Cal, with their 0 wins between the two of them, arent exactly great examples either. we know that Colin is having a hard time riding this decades bikes and he explicitly said that he came to GP too late to be successful. Cal in all his hype is only 2nd-class at best.

yes its possible to come from an outside series and win in GP. but is it likely today, with todays bikes, tracks, national series, GP feeder series? nope, and that the problem for teams/sponsors/etc. heres a good summary:
- total number of wins by SBK riders since the start of the MotoGP era... 6.
- number of wins by riders going through GP's feeder class in the same period... the rest.

if u really didnt mean "win", saying "ride in GP" to mean "make up the numbers in GP", then i dont see much point in talking about that.
 
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Dmitriy said:
Aha and how do you know AMA is for sale? You think This Guy gives 2 shits about people telling him what to do? How do you figure Dorna is going to approach this sale? I doubt saying "please sell us your AMA RR series so we could run it better since we have more experience" will work.

And lastly how do you know people haven't already tried multiple times to acquire the series?
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If we knew for a fact on everything there would be no point in having a discussion thread on it.
 
It would have to be production based bikes, or it wouldn't work. There is not enough money to support a prototype series, even like Moto3. Those bikes are easily $20k+.

But good, anything is better than what we have now..
 
Ducky_Fresh said:
It would have to be production based bikes, or it wouldn't work. There is not enough money to support a prototype series, even like Moto3. Those bikes are easily $20k+.

But good, anything is better than what we have now..
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i wouldnt be surprised if the top 10 in DSB and SS were spending over $30k on their bikes. as long as the Moto3 bikes were kept stock, i think itd be fine. the kit parts for those bikes add a ton. but at least they are race ready out of the box, unlike a production machine.

after the first year or two, used bikes should become available, lowering the initial investment to start racing. but the series has to make the first step to get people to buy the bikes IMO. a "if you build it, they will come" sort of deal.
 
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The AMA is dead as far as racing goes. It's just in the death throes. The time when an American could go to Europe and dominate Moto GP is also. When you have countries that start kids racing at 8 or 9 in competitive venues, the US can't compete. Those first five years are super important. I think Biaggi was the last serious Euro rider who didn't benefit from an early start.

The AMA died in 2007 when the economy imploded. It's still a corpse jerking wildly, but rigor mortis is setting in. Europe is where MotoGP is popular. If it's not a sport that involves balls and hitting them and other players, it won't be popular here.
 
afm199 said:
If it's not a sport that involves balls and hitting them and other players, it won't be popular here.
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Football combines two things Americans love most: violence punctuated by committee meetings.
 
dunno that there's anything for Dorna to acquire, beyond the FIM's blessing to operate within US borders

sure, there's sticky politics to accomplish, but that's their strength/weakness, anyway.....
 
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We're hurt geographically. Any sport that is big in other countries but not here, always struggles to establish here because you need to get a critical mass of followers that either doesn't exist or is too spread out. The crime of it all is, we had that in road racing and lost it. Getting it back is going to be so much harder than it would have been to maintain it. The road back is going to require top notch regional comps (keeps travel and costs down) that recruit young talent and build back up to national level sponsorship.
 
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