Air Bag vests

[dravnx]

School me on air bag vests. I 'm considering purchasing one. I've seen them save injury on 2 riders now. A friend's young son went down on the track doing 150 and had very little injuries and another friend and his wife were riding 2 up, hit a patch of deep pine needles when he swerved to avoid a pot hole at about 30 and went down. Her jacket deployed and she was injury free.

 

[Starpower]

They are so many options now, it is getting confusing. For track use many like the shortie style with the tether in the back and out of the way. Back when we had 2 choices I went with Hit-Air MLV. This is larger with a bit better rib protection and with added tail bone protection. Some don't like the idea of the tether and CO2 canister in front, however on track in full tuck I really don't notice it at all, unless I think about it and I can tell it's there, most with the MLV will say same. It is easier to connect in front too and when off bike I toss my tether across my R. grip to not forget to hook up. I always wear it and found that it does not really effect air flow. Prices are all over the place, and I've seen a few used one's for sale on here. I would not get too hung up on response time as even the slowest one's are more then fast enough. Cost go up with non-tether exotic electronics and sensors. Nothing to fail or dead batteries in a tether vest. I'm sure many will make sound arguments over the advantages on tether-less.

That's all I got for ya, GL!

 

[dittoalex]

I still have my Helite Turtle Airbag Vest in case I need it for track days or passenger or as a backup for my main, but I've been much happier with the version integrated in a jacket.

 

[Crispietogu]

I had the pleasure of crashing on street and track. I had the hit air vest that deployed. The crash wasn't too dramatic but I didn't come out with any neck back chest injuries. Shoulder was sore due to having no air bag in that area. The textile version got punctured from the slide. I was able to duck tape it together but that's the trade off with textile. Second was a high side with the helite gp best. I flew off and landed on my shoulder. Manage to break my collar bone due to having just depending on my shoulder armor. Everything else was saved. No neck or back pain and rib was sore but nothing bad. The leather from the gp vest is minimal damaged and can be reused. The trade off in terms of injury is you can injure anything on the side but your core body will be mostly fine. If. You go tech air from alpine stars you trade off primary protection for a more overall impact protection since the tech air has shoulder coverage but lacks full spinal immobilization

 

[Holeshot]

School me on air bag vests. I 'm considering purchasing one. I've seen them save injury on 2 riders now. A friend's young son went down on the track doing 150 and had very little injuries and another friend and his wife were riding 2 up, hit a patch of deep pine needles when he swerved to avoid a pot hole at about 30 and went down. Her jacket deployed and she was injury free.

No way, no how. I've put plenty of bikes on the ground and every time, all I want is to make sure I'm separated from the bike. The vests have the propensity to catch on handlebars, pegs, bodywork, etc and pin you to the bike. There's a reason leathers are free of areas that can catch on things as you slide.

They're a neat idea, but not for the track and for me, not anything I think is a good idea.

 

[S21FOLGORE]

I wrote this review (Hit-Air MLV-P Vest) back in 2017.

http://www.ducatimonsterforum.org/index.php?topic=75707.0

Rather than copy & past that thing, I'm going to write this specifically for you.

You have already seen how effective they are, so you probably don't need to watch this, but let me show this video for others who are interested in air-bag vest and reading this thread.

You don't need to watch the entire video. First one minute is enough.

[YOUTUBE]ZaykzE7P_XE[/YOUTUBE]

The rider walked away from this accident, without major injury.
(He was able to ride back home.)

Pretty impressive, right?



Vest vs Jacket
If you have more than one set of gear, the vest makes more sense.
The vest can be worn over the jacket / suit you already have, and it can work with any of the jacket / suit you have or you will have in near future.

Realistically, you need at least two sets of riding gear, one for warmer weather and one for colder weather (even in San Francisco Bay Area), so buying a jacket with airbag integrated just doesn’t make logical sense, to me.(What if the accident happens while you are wearing another jacket ?)


I keep mine on Aerostich Roadcrafter R-3, and it goes on with R-3, comes off with R-3.
No extra step to don/doff the vest.

[YOUTUBE]KMuGSgzcA_E[/YOUTUBE]

It is "MLV-P" model, in Hi-Viz yellow.
Japanese motorcycle police officers wear this one, in blue.

[YOUTUBE]fpuMuih5-m4[/YOUTUBE]

Air Flow in hot weather riding

It has split back kind of design, so it flows enough air. (When it’s getting close to 90°F, I switch to Dainese mesh jacket. I simply move the airbag vest onto the Dainese jacket, wear them as one unit. Although the vest blocks some air flow, I’ve never had any problem. Also, keep in mind that I wear chest protector all the time, that also block some air flow. Again, I have no complain about that.)

The only thing you'll have to do before starting to use the vest

you need to find a suitable anchor point and attach the coiled wire to the bike.

tether clipped here while not in use

Then, adjust the length of the coiled wire. Standing up on the foot pegs while still holding the handle bar with both hand, the coiled wire should be stretched out all the way.

This is the only thing you have to do before starting to use the vest.

About test data, Marketing BS, things most pople in US don't know ...

Back then when Hit-Air and Helite were pretty much the only options, some people thought Helite was superior product.

They weren't.

It's just that they were much better in marketing, that's all.

I'm not bashing Helite, and I'm not affiliated with Hit-Air, but ...

The truth is, Hit-Air just don't do good marketing. (Especially, outside of Japan.)
However, I found that their description being more honest.
(eg, showing the test data done by the 3rd party. Not trying to make their product sounds superior to the competitors.
Now, don’t get me wrong, I’m not bashing Helite, but, Helite web site says

“TURTLE CE Approved Airbag effective in 0.1 seconds”

A lot of people would think this as
CE certified Airbag completely deploys (fully inflated) in 0.1 seconds

but it is not....

What does "effective" really mean? It's very vague, open to wide range of interpretation.
100% effective, 50% effective, 10% effective ? They all can be called "effective".

Hit-Air clearly says the neck support part deploys the first, then the body part.
No CO2 based air-bag vest in the universe will fully inflate neck, chest, hip and back all at the same time.

On Helite web site,
No EN number shown.
No 3rd party test data shown.

If you are interested,
here are the safety rating and testing data of Hit Air air-bag vest.

here
https://www.hit-air.com/en/motorcycle/system/trial_data/system/trial_data/shogeki.html

here
https://www.hit-air.com/en/motorcycle/system/trial_data/system/trial_data/2008jari.html

and here
https://www.hit-air.com/en/motorcycle/system/trial_data/system/trial_data/2011jari.html

All the test done by JARI (Japan Automotive Research Institute).
http://www.jari.or.jp/tabid/200/Default.aspx

Same story with their protectors.


Anyway, at least, they (Mugen Denko, the company who makes and sells Hit-Air vest)) are honest enough to show the EN number (so that you, as a potential buyer, will know which part of the vest/ jacket is CE certified), instead of just saying “our product xxx is CE approved (which does NOT mean it is CE certified). Again, I am NOT attacking Helite airbag vest. I honestly believe they both work equally well in the real life examples.

(Okay, I need to take shower. Add a little bit more info later.)

 

[dravnx]

Wow, just wow. Thanks for the great information. I'm pretty much sold on a vest so I can wear it with my Klim Badlands jacket. I love my Klim and don't want to replace it.

 

[greenmonster]

The next step would be air bag pants, or even air bag gloves, and how about an air bag helmet with a drop down neck protector. I’m actually not joking here. Why stop at protecting just the chest/back area? If I fly off a bike and I’m headed for the pavement I’d like to look like the Michelin man

 

[nakedape]

Dianese smart vest for me. It took forever to get here, but it’s a cool device. Charge lasts forever. It’s comfortable under my jacket. Have not crash tested it. About $700

It is warm to cover your whole torso with neoprene. It was so nice in winter. I do put it on when I know I’m getting on the freeway, but skip it for under 40mph grocery runs.

Edit to address above question. Equestrian applications have a full cervical head hood thing going. One of my students used them and said they are saving lives left and right in horse world. Apparently riding horses is worse than motos

 

[greenmonster]

I wish also that the cost would come down on these vests . $600-$900 is out of reach for most people

 

[Woody146]

the new klim vest is pretty affordable at 399$ for the vest and a 12$ a month, OR 120$ a year subscription to the deployment company. or can outright buy the subscription for 399$

https://www.klim.com/Ai-1-Airbag-Vest-3046-000

they have them at sjbmw

 

[dravnx]

Safety devices are incremental. No single device is going to save you in all situation but todays technology can lessen injury and decrease your chances of needing that technology.
I'm glad there are those who have gone down numerous times without injury but I want to stack the deck in my favor.
The Hit Air MLV looks like the best compromise between protection, price and air flow. I ride in very hot weather and air flow is important to me.
I don't want to pay a subscription or have to charge anything. When I get to my motel room at the end of the day, I have enough sh*t to charge already so no wifi/BT systems.

 

[S21FOLGORE]

Pros and Cons of Air-Bag vest

Pros
Extra protection around the neck, entire back, entire chest, hip(both side and back) that regular body armor cannot offer.
Especially important thing is that the airbag vest stabilizes the riders neck as soon as the rider gets ejected from the bike.

Spinal cord injury is one of the worst nightmare.
Hit-Air (ever since they came out in mid 90s) clearly says the neck area inflate first, because stabilizing the neck first is more important than, say… saving rib cage, for example.

I personally recommend wearing the vest all the time if you decide to buy one.
Hitting deer in the evening / night is one thing, but, in today’s society we live in, I’m more worried about getting rear-ended by texting driver.

Additional Pros
Big reflective material is not some cheapo stuff, but LUMIDEX. Works great.

How it looks like from typical car driver’s point of view

Cons
Nothing, really. Other than ...

It makes you look dorky.
(Well, I wear Hi-Viz yellow Aerostich, so I already look dorky enough from the beginning.)



It makes you look fat.
(One piece Aerostich makes you look fatter than you actually are, anyway. Who cares. You can’t see yourself while riding.)

It costs over $500.
(A whole lot cheaper than ambulance ride to ER.)

Really the only thing you’d loose is “cool” biker image. And the level of protection the airbag vest offer far outweigh the uncool look.

Pros of tether & CO2 canister based system over Dainese / Alpinestars system

They are user resettable.

You can carry extra CO2 cartridge, allen key and screw. Anybody can do this. (Tech-Air, D-air system requires you to send the jacket/suit back to the factory every time it deploys.)
Imagine you are on a motorcycle trip, and you have a minor tip-over in the parking lot and the air-bag deploys.
With Tech-Air / D-air system, you won’t have air-bag protection for the rest of the trip.
With tether & Co2 system, you can re-arm your system in less than 30 min, all by yourself.


You can buy one or two extra canister with your vest, and you can even try to deploy the vest. With Tech-Air/ D-air system, user test is not possible. You just have to believe they would work.
And then, you can refold the vest and reset the trigger system by yourself.


How to re-arm Hit-Air vest
[YOUTUBE]zPiXqgyz-04[/YOUTUBE]
https://youtu.be/zPiXqgyz-04

Hit Air vest includes the tools (allen key and screw) to reset the vest. The only thing you have to buy separately is CO2 canister.
(I was going to make a video like that, but I totally forgot while making all other videos …)

Note
Resetting the vest is pretty simple, but there are two important things to mention.

Look at 3:35 - 3:50. You must remove the set screw. If you don't, the air bag won't deploy.

Look at 3:58. The red plastic cover must be moved up. If you forget, the air bag won't deploy.

 

[dravnx]

My friends wife was able to rearm her jacket while on the trip because they carried extra cartridges and the tools.

 

[S21FOLGORE]

In hot weather
When it’s getting closer to 90 °F, I switch to Dainese Super Speed Tex (mesh) jacket. (The pants are old D-dry, with liner removed.)

MLV-P flows enough air.
The chest protector blocks more air than anything I wear, actually.
(This one (RS Taichi) I wear when I switch to Dainese Jacket. My R-3 had TF-3 chest pad attached .)

Deployment test video

[YOUTUBE]uNzvYjD_7Dk[/YOUTUBE]

[YOUTUBE]HGXwHLrf7T0[/YOUTUBE]


Now, no protective gear is perfect. We all know that.

Example of air-bag vest working good
(Skip to 8:40)
[YOUTUBE]wtmV8DDfIP0[/YOUTUBE]



Example of air-bag vest doesn’t really work
[YOUTUBE]M9Ag_ZmRt3w[/YOUTUBE]


In the 2nd video, what happened was, …
He was hit by another rider, went down, BUT, WAS NOT EJECTED from the bike.
He was trapped between the bike and the ground, kept on sliding underneath the bike until they stop on gravel.
This can happen to any system.
If you get trapped under your bike and sliding, the air-bag vest really won’t help.

 

[nakedape]

I don't want to pay a subscription or have to charge anything. When I get to my motel room at the end of the day, I have enough sh*t to charge already so no wifi/BT systems.

Dainese system is one time cost only. They give you an access code for software, you take it out of shipping mode, and that's it. I haven't been using it so I plugged it in and there was the first update for 2020.

GPS makes sure you're actually rolling at speed before the system arms itself. With the hit-air system (flame suit on) you could tip off the bike and roll away not too far and it would deploy. Conversely (flame suit off?) the hit air can be enabled easily after a deployment with fresh cartridges. The Dainese needs new air cells and a factory refresh.

Each system has its merits. I like that mine turns on when it detects the bike running and turns off when it stops. Even as a daily commuter the battery lasts forever.

 

[S21FOLGORE]

The story most people in US don't know...

Hit-Air airbag vest was invented by a Japanese guy Kenji Takeuchi, back in the mid 90s. (1995).
It was pretty much his personal project (in other word, it wasn't his job, it wasn't related to his business), and he nearly bankrupted while developing the vest.
He had totally different kind of business (not motorcycle related). He did this Airbag vest project purely for saving motorcycle rider's life.
A lot of time, work, and money went into the development.
When he finally made the vest that was functional enough to be sold to the public, H*n&a offered him big money, to make a contract with them, so that they can sell Air-Bag vest as "H*n&a customer exclusive item".
The amount of money that was offered was big enough to cover all the debts and there would still be enough change left.
Kenji Takeuchi turned this offer down. He did not like the idea (of the Air-Bag Vest being used as some sort of marketing item. It would make his invention (Air-Bag vest) only available to the riders who purchase brand new H*n&a motorcycles at the selected dealership.)

Instead, he started his own company(while still having the huge debuts from Air-bag vest development), "Mugen Denko", which is the company that makes and sells Hit-Air vest.

Here’s the video of the story of this man.
(Sorry, it’s Japanese only video, there’s no subtitles.)

[YOUTUBE]dAWVQc3QAqY[/YOUTUBE]

There’s a youtube video made by pretty well known motovlogger who’s whining about the cost of airbag vest.
Saying it's such a simple system that they shouldn't cost that much, blah blah, blah.
Don’t listen to that guy. He doesn’t even know simple stuff such as how to insert foam ear plugs, yet, making the “how to insert foam ear plug” video and preaching people.

The CO2 & Tether based air-bag system may seem to be simple and easy to produce, but it isn't.
The inventor of this system almost lost everything he had in order to develop this air-bag system.
And, he rejected the instant big, big money offer made by the world biggest motorcycle manufacturer, because he wanted this system openly available to the public.

 

[Smudgemo]

My neighbor and I got Helite Turtles in hi-viz on sale in Jan '19. Neither of us has gone down to report on the outcome, but we were both parents commuting and figured it was a worthwhile investment. Instructions say you can take the back armor from your jacket, but I left it in because I don't always use it.

Admittedly, when I run down to get groceries or take my daughters out for a mellow ride in the hills, I don't bother with it. But I'm eyeing up some sport-touring bikes from the '90s with dreams of riding up to Vancouver with my older daughter before she's off to college in a couple of years. I'll definitely buy a second vest for her unless my neighbor is willing to lend his.

I've crashed on my mountain bike enough times to know what hurts, and in my mind it's a worthwhile investment. I also don't care what I look like as long as I'm seen..

 

[dittoalex]

The next step would be air bag pants, or even air bag gloves, and how about an air bag helmet with a drop down neck protector. I’m actually not joking here. Why stop at protecting just the chest/back area? If I fly off a bike and I’m headed for the pavement I’d like to look like the Michelin man

The Gold Wing has an airbag. An accident will see you bounce off to the moon.

 

[greenmonster]

The Gold Wing has an airbag. An accident will see you bounce off to the moon.

There! that little space suited guy on the right! That's what I'm talkin' 'bout