Anti-Asian Hate Crimes

[tzrider]

Anyone who thinks we can outgun the authorities is delusional.

If you have a gun fine.

There are many rational reasons to own one.

But not everyone needs a gun and not everyone is clear headed enough to own and use a gun responsibly.

To imply that not owning a gun is like choosing not to vote is just plain bananas.

The Constitution does not require Citizens to own guns.

It doesn’t require people to vote, for that matter.

 

[GAJ]

IDK, I lived in Belgium (70s) and the UK (mid 60s) as well as Colombia.

While there was indeed fear (in the early 1960s) of the bandits in the hills that would regularly stop buses and rob people in Colombia, folks in the UK and Belgium were not aggressive or impolite despite strict gun laws.

I've returned to all those Countries in the last five years and things seemed much the same.

Mind you, living in Connecticut, (early 70s) Miami (Cocaine Cowboy late 70s/80s) and here in the Bay Area (since 1984) I've never felt the need to own a gun much less carry one.

 

[Eldritch]

Yeah, but before that was the killing of Latasha Harlins.

Unintended consequences, I guess,

That was sad of course, but I do not see how it is related?

That’s not carrying guns; that’s lying with guns on rooftops.

I largely recommend against people carrying firearms. I also recommend they do not carry pipe wrenches or vacuum cleaners. Those are also tools you should have in your home in case you need them though.

I am continuing to try and be an ally, so those in the Asian community asking me, I am offering advice on firearms and self defense/martial arts. I am also encouraging them to not approach these things as a solution to the unfortunate events happening right now, they are not a good one.

 

[nbean16]

I understand you have a very poor knowledge of contemporary violent state conflict and guerilla warfare tactics. I do not.

It is indisputable that the ownership of participation in the militia is the right of every American. It is not an issue for debate. The law is wildly clear.

Neither are citizens required to vote, but similarly, our society is better if the citizens do choose to take responsibility for their civic duty and participate. Along those same lines, the 1st would imply citizens have a responsibility to read and be informed before they do vote, and make educated decisions on issues through their own research.

If you do not study the issues, you rely on other citizens to shape the policy of society, if you do not vote, you rely on other citizens to own the leadership of society, if you do not prepare to participate in the militia, you rely on others to manage the safety of our society.

None of these are the actions of a responsible citizen.

Our citizenship does not require we behave responsibly with it and not take it for granted, but it certainly is nice when citizens do own those responsibilities.



I agree. In an effort to not further distract into a debate with those who choose to let others manage their safety for them them, I would bring back this message as you indicated.

Citizens should possess arms out of responsibility, not fear. Those who purchase arms out of fear are more likely to use them irresponsibly, which is bad for our people.

My hope is that this issue does not continue to escalate in that direction, but I am doing my best to be an ally in whatever ways i can.

 

[tuxumino]

So what do people think would be the end result of Asians carrying guns and shooting people trying to assault them?

Bear in mind that the law of unintended consequences will be in play.

criminals would attack Asians to get guns.

For any weapon to stop an assault it must be deployed and ready for use: be it a knife, gun, taser, stun gun or pepper spray. Most of these assaults are surprises, the victim isn't aware they're under attack until it happens, at that point it's a little late to get out your weapon. Pepper spray in your purse does you no good if someone already has grabbed your purse.

The first component of self defense is awareness, not getting into the situation where you need self defense is best.
If you are attacked it will most likely be a surprise, you will not have time to get the pepper spray out of your pocket until you separate from the the attackers, so basic self defense reactions have to be learned and practiced.

 

[Eldritch]

criminals would attack Asians to get guns.

For any weapon to stop an assault it must be deployed and ready for use: be it a knife, gun, taser, stun gun or pepper spray. Most of these assaults are surprises, the victim isn't aware they're under attack until it happens, at that point it's a little late to get out your weapon. Pepper spray in your purse does you no good if someone already has grabbed your purse.

The first component of self defense is awareness, not getting into the situation where you need self defense is best.
If you are attacked it will most likely be a surprise, you will not have time to get the pepper spray out of your pocket until you separate from the the attackers, so basic self defense reactions have to be learned and practiced.

Yes, that is the psych training I was talking about. Situational awareness and flight planning is so much more important than arms for street travel.

 

[Agent Orange]

I dont think having a gun is going to be beneficial for most of these folks getting mugged, and I say that as a gun owner myself. Personally, I would never want CCW because if anything the state of CA would probably find me guilty for using it even if it were a case for self defense. I've told others this but the guns I own are a last line of defense, basically a motherfucker would have to be in my home for him to get shot. If thats the case, then every law abiding American citizen should own.

Some old lady walking down the street strapped with a 380? Probably not a good idea.

 

[Bay Arean]

I dont think having a gun is going to be beneficial for most of these folks getting mugged, and I say that as a gun owner myself. Personally, I would never want CCW because if anything the state of CA would probably find me guilty for using it even if it were a case for self defense. I've told others this but the guns I own are a last line of defense, basically a motherfucker would have to be in my home for him to get shot. If thats the case, then every law abiding American citizen should own.

Some old lady walking down the street strapped with a 380? Probably not a good idea.

I think somewhere in this, though, is the bigger picture of a lawless society.

Do we want to live in a country where people have to obey animalistic personal standards of behavior? The old, sickly and young are the objects of predation in the natural worlds of predators and herd prey. Personally, I want an old lady to have the right to walk our streets safely, as well as our children or handicapped people. To abandon responsibility and return to that state is what I think of when you talk about having awareness. Let's all hide in our houses unless we are vigorous strong members of the species. Sheeyit.

You might believe old people shouldn't drive their cars. Well, what happens when they need a quart of milk? It's not safe for them to drive, not safe for them to walk. I guess we should make them all use Doordash for basic needs so we can have a guilt-free scenario of gunless citizenry.

Maybe you don't want an old lady carrying. BUt maybe if more are carrying then assholes aren't so bold. I don't pretend to have the answer but anymore, we just seem pretty gutless when it comes to being victimized by crime. The latest thing people do is to pull out cellphones to video attacks rather than somehow engage to intervene. Why? Well, for one thing, they don't want to get shot. Its the larger reasoning it out that makes me unsure of the unarmed approach to civil life. In itself, it SEEMS more civilized, but this keeps getting played out.....

 

[GAJ]

While there are hot spots as always, in general, aggravated assault numbers have improved.

 

[Agent Orange]

I think somewhere in this, though, is the bigger picture of a lawless society.

Do we want to live in a country where people have to obey animalistic personal standards of behavior? The old, sickly and young are the objects of predation in the natural worlds of predators and herd prey. Personally, I want an old lady to have the right to walk our streets safely, as well as our children or handicapped people. To abandon responsibility and return to that state is what I think of when you talk about having awareness. Let's all hide in our houses unless we are vigorous strong members of the species. Sheeyit.

You might believe old people shouldn't drive their cars. Well, what happens when they need a quart of milk? It's not safe for them to drive, not safe for them to walk. I guess we should make them all use Doordash for basic needs so we can have a guilt-free scenario of gunless citizenry.

Maybe you don't want an old lady carrying. BUt maybe if more are carrying then assholes aren't so bold. I don't pretend to have the answer but anymore, we just seem pretty gutless when it comes to being victimized by crime. The latest thing people do is to pull out cellphones to video attacks rather than somehow engage to intervene. Why? Well, for one thing, they don't want to get shot. Its the larger reasoning it out that makes me unsure of the unarmed approach to civil life. In itself, it SEEMS more civilized, but this keeps getting played out.....

Yah I dont have an answer unfortunately. The thought of my mom and grandma being a victim is in the back of my head, but I'm wondering if carrying a gun is worth more the trouble than the payoff. I mean look what happened to that shop owner in Oakland, he was the one arrested instead of the actual perp. LEO expects us to what, call 911 and hope they get here in time to catch the bad guy?

 

[OnFire]

I agree. In an effort to not further distract into a debate with those who choose to let others manage their safety for them them, I would bring back this message as you indicated.

.

Militias and arms are not the only way to manage and provide safety. Take, for example, the thousands of parents and volunteers who provide after school care and activities for kids and young adults. If those are the ones you refer to as 'others' then I agree with your statement above.

 

[wazzuFreddo]

Who the heck would want to go to that h.s.? Never knew a public high school could have an admissions process...just like Taiwan and other Asian countries, which is nuts. Insane concentration of burnout kids and tiger parents, wtf. My older son (7th) attends a private school, mildly competitive, nothing like Harker. One of his good friends is Korean and her parents have private tutors, cram school style. She's up all night and doing work all weekend for cram school stuff. She's not taking it well at all, the "don't complain" and "honor your family" is at the maximum level .

Sounds like hell. The IB program I was in was stressful enough and I didn't even take it as seriously as some of my classmates did.

Got told I was ruining my potential by going to Washington State and not "stretching to get into MIT." Screw all that noise.

We make sure our kids do their schoolwork and put effort into it, but we also make sure they have time to enjoy their youth.

 

[EBDan]

Out of curiosity, has the increase in violence against Asians affected your riding plans (for those of you who are Asian) ... especially if you had planned road trips through different states in the next few months?

 

[scootergmc]

Out of curiosity, has the increase in violence against Asians affected your riding plans (for those of you who are Asian) ... especially if you had planned road trips through different states in the next few months?

Is there an anti-asian belt people are looking to avoid?

 

[NSR500]

Out of curiosity, has the increase in violence against Asians affected your riding plans (for those of you who are Asian) ... especially if you had planned road trips through different states in the next few months?

The violence has always existed, it's just getting increased media coverage.
As for affected riding plans it should be universal amongst all demographics of people; Avoid the Ghetto.

 

[ScorpioVI]

Anyone who thinks we can outgun the authorities is delusional.

There's a bunch of goat farmers in Afghanistan who would argue with this. 20 years of the greatest military in the world putting their finest resources to bear and we're pretty much right back where we started, minus 2300 of our young men and women and countless billions of dollars wasted.

Now, a lot of those young folk put their lives on the line in places like Afghanistan and Iraq and gained valuable experience are now part of the populace who thinks WE can outgun the authorities.

 

[tzrider]

The violence has always existed, it's just getting increased media coverage.
As for affected riding plans it should be universal amongst all demographics of people; Avoid the Ghetto.

It's getting increased media coverage because it's happening more. In 2020, overall hate crime rates in the US dropped, but hate crimes against Asian Americans increased about 150%.

Source

 

[AbsolutEnduser]

I grew up in ..
I'm more familiar with private schools near San Jose because I had to research it for our kids.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4WZ6nDz-3w

The violence has always existed, it's just getting increased media coverage.
As for affected riding plans it should be universal amongst all demographics of people; Avoid the Ghetto.

It's getting increased media coverage because it's happening more. In 2020, overall hate crime rates in the US dropped, but hate crimes against Asian Americans increased about 150%.

Speaking of...Lowell High and the school system in San Francisco (I know, not directly relating to "Crimes" but certainly to posts in the past 1-2 pages),
this news is just coming out. They way I read it, the current (high-ranking?) member of the SF-School-Board has previously posted something questionable:

BREAKING: San Francisco school board vp Alison Collins is under fire for racist tweets targeting Asian Americans and their "white supremacist thinking to assimilate and get ahead."

https://www.sfchronicle.com/local-p...ard-member-criticized-for-racist-16039069.php

I have to doubt everything that has been posted. Did she know what she could have meant , or what may have been impllied? And BTW, I have a question. What does "Ts, Ss, and Ps" mean?!?! (No joke, I'm asking what it means, instead of googling it.)

 

[bojangle]

Yeah, it's not without contradiction and doesn't provide gray area. I don't own weapons either but I understand the thinking behind his contention. So I contradict it myself and would not be a good citizen in his book either. I was changing/editing argument after posting because of it....

You say it makes no sense, but you DO realize that when social disorder looms, the police cannot protect everyone, right? They can't even do it right now. Most of us live in a thin margin of social trust that can easily be disrupted. We are delusional most of the time regarding safety.

I'd rather live in a society where people had the right than not and this current situation with my Asian-American countrymen is an example. We happen to be gutting police departments in our latest social experiment in places that just happen to have a rise in this type of crime. I am not saying it's causal, but it sure ain't helping.

Also about 1821. More like 1891 if you are going to go there. California was the beginning of the Wild West during the Gold Rush. People were always armed in those days for self-protection and this lasted for a few more decades until enough urban police forces and social order took hold.

I feel that its a luxury, and a hard-earned one, to NOT have to own weapons for self-protection. But it often feels like its time to arm up, but a person has to consider their imagination, fear-based thinking capacity, in that calculation.

Agreed! ^^^

The violence has always existed, it's just getting increased media coverage.
As for affected riding plans it should be universal amongst all demographics of people; Avoid the Ghetto.

Yup.

It's getting increased media coverage because it's happening more. In 2020, overall hate crime rates in the US dropped, but hate crimes against Asian Americans increased about 150%.

Source

Not so sure about that. It may be that reports of hate crimes against Asians increased by that much, but I seriously doubt actual hate crimes did. I watched the news clip in your source. It doesn't prove hate crimes have increased. It does hint towards other reasons, such as carrying cash around Chinese New Year. Even the Oakland Police Chief said they appear to be crimes of opportunity. One of the women they interviewed talked about being attacked by a group and thrown to the ground when she was walking alone on a street in Oakland. Toward the end of the clip, they go back to her and now she mentions it was a mugging (robbery). OK, no proof of a hate crime there, but plenty of proof robbery was the motivation. They went on to say much of it is verbal assaults or whatnot, and described an experience where a driver drove by and yelled coronavirus at an Asian female. While that's ignorant and all, it's not a crime, let alone a hate crime.


There is plenty for anyone to be concerned about walking the streets alone in Oakland. I wouldn't do it. I wouldn't be surprised if I was attacked and robbed either, as a white male.

 

[scootergmc]

It's getting increased media coverage because it's happening more. In 2020, overall hate crime rates in the US dropped, but hate crimes against Asian Americans increased about 150%.

Source

https://www.csusb.edu/sites/default/files/FACT SHEET- Anti-Asian Hate 2020 3.2.21.pdf

Read into that "report." It's hardly that. It's a sample of 16 cities and very non-exhaustive and undefined at that. I can't tell whether those stats contain "prejudicial words" or not, because they refer to it in the actual document.

Like has been said, I think the media is running with a trendy topic, however the truth is skewed.