Any old (>60) track-day riders here?

[Holeshot]

Tom, how'd it go? What tires tires did you lace up on her? She's a looker.....

 

[ThinkFast]

Tom, how'd it go? What tires tires did you lace up on her? She's a looker.....

Was a lot of fun. Massively windy day - woke up and it was howling, coming out of the north. 35mph sustained, gusts at 45ish. So headwind down the front straight at TH-west. Interesting…

Tossed on a set of Pirelli SC3s. Love those - more familiar profile to me than slicks, and just as sticky.



Riding was surprisingly manageable despite the wind. Other than having to recalibrate the braking point for T1, the only other place it felt sketchy all day was going up the little rise into T8, where you have to toss it in blind and then head down the hill. It’s fast up there and I was always worried there’d be a gust just as I was setting my exit line and suddenly I’d be too far one side or the other and in the grass.

The SC3s were amazing. No warmers - I’d park in the sun and do some hard braking in the pit out and then a slow warmup lap and they were good to go.

B group. Some real sketchballs in that group, as usual. Only a dozen or so out there at a time, I think, so manageable numbers. The flagging crews were also a little off, in my opinion. I came out of T1 and found a bike laying literally mid track. It must’ve been there for a little bit because it wasn’t even sliding, and the rider was standing off to the ride in the grass. Flagger was oblivious even though it was immediately in front of the flag station - no yellow, nothing. I started waving my arm like a madman trying to get their attention. Unbelievable. Saw similar again at the station between T3/4/5.

Then down in T10, where there was no one in the flag station, some dude had been trying to round me up for the last couple of turns and couldn’t get it done, so he tries to go around me on the outside. Now I’m not that fast anyways, but that’s a really slow corner. So he takes the wide line and wicks it up. Makes the pass, but has to stay leaned over hard to clear the tire wall on the exit onto the front straight. I’m just getting my bike stood up and on the gas and suddenly sparks start flying. Dude low sided like 10 feet in front of me. We weren’t going that fast yet. Just after he hits the deck he tries to stand up, and of course goes ass over teakettle. This all was happening less than 10 yards in front of me and I’m wondering how I’m going to crash - will it be an endo? Or something more airborne? Oh man…I miss him by 5-10 feet. There was only one lap in the session. He could’ve waited another 5-10 seconds and dusted me on the straight. Impatience did him in. And he oiled the track, so they closed it down and called lunch early at 12 instead of 1:00 to clean it up.

More sketchy behavior around pit in between T9 and T10. It’s a pretty short chute, with pit-in straight off the end of the chute past T10, and T10 is a hairpin left hander onto the front straight. So people set up wide right for the entry into 10, while people heading to the pits should stay wide track right with their hand up or leg out, starting at least from the entry to T9.

In three of the five sessions I ran I saw someone bail from the middle of group going into T10, and they were in the middle of a pack of five or six bikes. There was no one manning the corner station there, so none of the PTT folks ever saw it.

Another guy and me ended up chasing each other around the track for a few sessions and had a blast. He was rocking one of the 360º video rigs and shared some clips he had with me in them. Check out this video- it opens with me to his left, staying in front of him. Watch the guy in front of me heading into T10 at around 00:18. Middle of a tight group he just decides, “oh, I guess I’ll go off now. See ya.” Hairball move, dude.

But hey, that’s why I run B group

Overall, it was a lot of fun. People were very friendly. The young guy with the video camera couldn’t believe someone so old and decrepit was out there doing this and hanging with him on the track. At one point we were side by side heading into a tight corner coming up on a slower rider who was mid track on the turn exit. Just as we exit he flares right and I go left and we bookended the poor soul in the middle. It was clean and no one freaked out, but man I was giggling in my helmet like a little kid.

What a great day. Got home, dinner and hot tub, and to bed. This morning, though, I woke up and felt like I was in a heavy gym on the bench press all day, arms and shoulders are feeling worked. Bike needs some adjustments as the ergos are not working for me. Clipons with a bit of a rise would help (any recs??), as would some shorty levers and a quick shifter, stat.

Ok. So that’s my (unintended) trackday report. Thanks for asking

 

[Holeshot]

You ride good Tom! Love the dude who throws the hand up mid corner and darts for the pits. Your veteran eyes picked that up right away...The tired thing goes away as you well know...it's just the first time you've run like that in awhile. Your sense of speed is up enough to be more relaxed next time out. I suspect you may need to use more legs too. Would be fun to ride together this season...and yah; I'm biased, but I love the Pirelli Super Corsa's too!

Before changing clip in height; is there a mobllity limitation that you have? I suspect that you'll loosen up next time out. I don't like shorty levers are all: leverage points are poor and when the pads start to fade, you've got less real estate on the lever to adjust to. IMO: change the pads. Given how nice the bike is, spend the money for the Brembo Z04's. No; they're not cheap. Yes; they'll save you from many braking caused accidents. No shit. They last a long time too and give you some excellent ability to point the front end with the brake lever. If you end up doing suspension and use us (GP Suspension) for cartridges, can cut some dollars off to help with those pads....

Great report too. I got some tingles reading....which motivates me!

 

[cpc]

Hi, Tom. Congrats on the new bike!
I was talking to a guy on a GS at Sears Point on the 11th who was shopping R7s....
Was that you? I was on a Duke 890r under the bleachers.
Either way, have fun!
David

 

[ThinkFast]

Thanks, Berto. Would definitely welcome chance to ride with you this season. I’d love to hear more about your observations from that little clip and your recommendations. Let me know when you’re going. I’m only going to ride at TH-West and Sonoma this year. No Laguna, BW, or TH-East for me.

Before changing clip in height; is there a mobllity limitation that you have? I suspect that you'll loosen up next time out. I don't like shorty levers are all: leverage points are poor and when the pads start to fade, you've got less real estate on the lever to adjust to. IMO: change the pads.

No mobility limitations - just general amount of weight on my forearms and hands. Wouldn’t mind a bit more of an upright positioning.
The brakes on this thing are plenty good - Brembo master cylinder on the fronts. really powerful. Two fingers everywhere. What’s killing me is the lever reach on both clutch and brake levers, which are non adjustable.

Come on out - let’s do some laps.

 

[ThinkFast]

Hi, Tom. Congrats on the new bike!
I was talking to a guy on a GS at Sears Point on the 11th who was shopping R7s....
Was that you? I was on a Duke 890r under the bleachers.
Either way, have fun!
David

Hey David - yes indeed that was me. Was looking for you at T-hill - couldn’t recall if we talked about whether you had lined up any other days this season. Which run group do you usually run in? Maybe we’ll have a chance to do some laps (with Berto!) this year.

 

[cpc]

Well then, double congrats on the bike!
I have a bunch more days lined up this year, starting with Thill west on Sun the 24th!
I bounce between A and B depending on if I am at Sears or Thill and how I am feeling
I would love to spin some laps!!
Are you gonna make it back out to west this weekend?
Cheers,
David

 

[ThinkFast]

Thinking about it. I’ll DM you.

 

[ThinkFast]

Great - I have a bunch on my calendar, too.

Are you gonna make it back out to west this weekend?

Dunno. Thinking about it. Would love to find someone to share the ride up/trailering with. U-Haul boogie is getting old already, and I don’t have much space for a trailer - even a standup. May have to sell a car to open up some garage space. Should probably do that anyways.

 

[Holeshot]

Thanks, Berto. Would definitely welcome chance to ride with you this season. I’d love to hear more about your observations from that little clip and your recommendations. Let me know when you’re going. I’m only going to ride at TH-West and Sonoma this year. No Laguna, BW, or TH-East for me.

No mobility limitations - just general amount of weight on my forearms and hands. Wouldn’t mind a bit more of an upright positioning.
The brakes on this thing are plenty good - Brembo master cylinder on the fronts. really powerful. Two fingers everywhere. What’s killing me is the lever reach on both clutch and brake levers, which are non adjustable.

Come on out - let’s do some laps.

I'll find a day to spin laps together for sure. Suggest adjustable long levers based on my earlier comment. Shorties for track riding limit your control/ options...as I'm sure you know.

 

[ThinkFast]

I'll find a day to spin laps together for sure. Suggest adjustable long levers based on my earlier comment. Shorties for track riding limit your control/ options...as I'm sure you know.

Cool. I just signed up for Sonoma on 6/15.

And yesterday did my second trackday with this bike up at T-Hill West again. This time I spent the day pitting and riding laps with @cpc (aka David). What a great day it was - weather was excellent with a nice breeze and staying fairly cool until later in the afternoon. There was did plenty of bench racing under his EZ-up between sessions - was really a great time.

I suspect you may need to use more legs too.

Wow, Berto. Impressive you spotted that just from that clip. I gave that a try yesterday and man what a game-changer that was. So much more control, especially after initial tip in to fine tune the line. I don’t recall ever doing this before all the time I was racing - holy moly. Thank you. Any other tips???

Will be fun to try this out at Sonoma, which is a clockwise track. T-H West is counter-clockwise, so lots of left turns. Using my leg to push into the tank on the right handers felt odd yesterday, so maybe it will feel more natural after running at Sears.

 

[cpc]

Yessir, Tom, thanks for the company, good times! I finish a catering event on the 14th and am gonna have to make a game-time decision for Sears.

 

[tuxumino]

I was at T-Hill west yesterday, quite a challenging course. It'll take a few more trips to figure out the turn 1 complex and the turn 7 hairpin.
got to Ride a R7 for a session, I was somewhat disappointed with it, heavy turn in compared to my Zed400.

 

[ThinkFast]

I was at T-Hill west yesterday, quite a challenging course. It'll take a few more trips to figure out the turn 1 complex and the turn 7 hairpin.
got to Ride a R7 for a session, I was somewhat disappointed with it, heavy turn in compared to my Zed400.

If I’d known we could’ve caught up with you. Which run group were you in? I was running B+. I tested the R9 - was a lot of fun. Just me and Michael (the Yamaha rep running the demos). We put in 4-5 hot laps, and he wasn’t holding much back.

I’m still getting used to the R7. It rides differently than the Ninjette, that’s for sure. I had been renting those the last couple years on that track, so I have a decent baseline to compare them. R7 runs 180 rear, and has frame geometry more like a middleweight bike. That and suspension setup and ride height I think need some fine tuning on the R7 to great it to be a bit more flickable.

 

[NorCal Factory]

I demoed an R9 at West last year and the turn in was slow. It felt like the tire pressure was too low. I asked the guys at the demo booth and they said that’s what Pirelli told them but it was a low pressure. if you added a more normal TP I am sure it would turn better.

 

[Holeshot]

Wow, Berto. Impressive you spotted that just from that clip. I gave that a try yesterday and man what a game-changer that was. So much more control, especially after initial tip in to fine tune the line. I don’t recall ever doing this before all the time I was racing - holy moly. Thank you. Any other tips???

Great to read Tom! I know to look for it cause it was my issue was well...once weight is off the front end, the front end moves so much better and slides become easier to manage/ recognize. Other tips? Eyes up. Always. I never stopped telling myself this and still use it all the time. It's so easy to have the eyes pull down towards our fenders...Eyes moving and up is the best case...and to be clear, it's not "always" eyes up, but at least moving; from your acceleration point on the inside of a corner to the exit marker (down the track). Eyes alone are worth seconds....

That and suspension setup and ride height I think need some fine tuning on the R7 to great it to be a bit more flickable.

The easiest guess here is spring rate. Too soft a rear for rider weight takes away swingarm angle and load (nose pressure) off the front end. When the ass sits down, the forks chopper out. Maybe the rear is too soft to too low or both...?

I demoed an R9 at West last year and the turn in was slow. It felt like the tire pressure was too low. I asked the guys at the demo booth and they said that’s what Pirelli told them but it was a low pressure. if you added a more normal TP I am sure it would turn better.

I wonder what the pressure was. I mean, if it was too low, the tire will "wallow on acceleration. Not the Pirelli wag...that's normal, but wallowing is sign of a low air pressure. I can't imagine they set the pressures lower than 24 lbs or so for the rear. FWIW, adding rear tire pressure (where the pressure is already in a ridable range) hasn't helped a bike turn for me. It has taken away from grip if the tire's starting to tear though. All of this applies to rear tire...the front tire is a different animal. I think your and Tom's problem may have to do with the baseline setups on the bikes and weight....possibly? Especially If they're demo bikes...Oh and the R9 OEM swingarm has had complaints since released...

 

[dammyneckhurts]

Whaat? Where do you live where you can do that many?

I live in Canada. Last few years have been riding mostly at Area 27 in B.C. during the summers, and Inde Motorsports Ranch in Arizona during the winters.

 

[budman]

That is sweet.

Never heard of either track. I assume they are fun.
How big are they?? Other stuff??

 

[ST Guy]

I’ve only ever done track days on four wheels. But I do remember a couple of friends, both pushing 70 at the time, who used to race speedway at Baylands. Occasionally they would win. And they had a hell of a lot of fun.

 

[dammyneckhurts]

That is sweet.

Never heard of either track. I assume they are fun.
How big are they?? Other stuff??

Area 27 length is 3 miles with a mix of all types of corners and lots of elevation changes, it's an amazing track. Built in 2016, pavement is awesome and 10 year on it has zero bumps and literally not one single crack in the pavement. It's a members based track where members get 15 days a month and they rent the other 15 to track day providers. The location is awesome and in the South Okanagen Valley in BC where the climate is hot and dry, the valley has lots of wineries, vinyards are everywhere. Youtube Video:

.

Inde Motorsports Ranch in Arizona is also a members base track. By most racetrack standards it is a bit tighter with a few quick elevation changes, one longish straight and then the rest of the lap flows one corner into the next. Inde is pretty remote, not much there other than the track outside the town of Willcox.