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Degenerative Disc Issues

Mike95060 said:
So, I'm a big believer that "motion is lotion" and "we don't stop moving because we get old, we get old because we stop moving." Granted, it's easier for me to say that at 47 than it is for someone else to say at 65. However, I do have some non scientific personal experience that supports those ideas. My legs below the knee are "sub optimal" since birth. I have arthritis in both ankles and limited range of motion in both. For most of my life I accepted that they we just fucked and there wasn't much I could do but endure it.
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Facts. Discs and cartilage don't have a direct blood supply, so the only way to get nutrients into them is through motion. This is called "imbibition" or "nutrient pumping"

About once a week I feel like my foot is frozen or that it's got plantar fasciitis, but it's actually spinal nerve compression. Only way to stave it off is by staying active instead of sitting at a computer all day.
 
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There is another idea I came across about movement and flexibility that I wanna share with y'all. Again, this is just an idea that's helped me. If an expert out there can explain why this is crap, please do. I won't be offended. The idea goes like this:

Imagine you dropped dead right this second. What would happen to your body? It would get really floppy right? You could probably arrange your limbs in any way you want without them "fighting back" and resisting you. What does that tell us? Could it be telling us that the resistance we feel when we are trying to stretch or improve our range of motion IS NOT from our muscles and ligaments and fascia? If all that stuff is floppy when we are dead, what's keeping it stiff or inflexible while we are still alive? Is it actually our nervous system trying to "protect" us from unfamiliar movement patterns? Every individual muscle fiber in you body is hard wired to your brain. Maybe that wiring and CPU need a software update. Maybe getting that system to accept the new normal is what will allow our joints to move more freely. We need to reprogram our OS to allow the new ranges of motion we are trying to get to. Sounds pretty plausible to me.

With that in mind, Part of my "I'm on the floor trying to move all my joints through their ENTIRE range of motion" practice in the conscious "telling" my nervous system "its ok to go there" while I hold a position. Yeah, sometime I talk out loud to whatever body part I'm working on. "It's ok little hip, you can get that ball socket to be there just fine. Your good!" Yes, It feels like weirdo hippy shit that I will not do in a room full of gym bros staking plates for dates. I don't care. I do this shit at home and I don't usually talk about it much. :laughing Even if you don't wanna talk to your body out loud, having a kind internal dialogue to your body parts should IMHO improve the mind-body connection that I think is really important for a functional healthy body. Full disclosure, a little THC helps all of that feel like a pleasant break from a world that tries hard to grind us into dust. YMMV.
 
I've got a ruptured L4-L5, from a youth full of catching air and eating shit.

So, now at age 50, it's lumbar and sciatica pain.
Two steroid injections. 2x Daily dose of Meloxicam

Luckily for me riding my bike is much easier on my back than driving a car believe it or not.
 
Before I forget... cuz Amazon is quicker than a sneeze…Seems to me that the pump up collar is good for relief while upright, simple movements, raised computer, pillow on lap reading, TV. Don’t crank it tho, gotta circulate. Also maybe don’t rest chin too much or wear too long, weakens us. With the bed stretcher a malleable pillow that supports the neck curve but doesn’t bend the head forward too much, needs to be comfortable. But DON’T fall asleep that way, I promise it would not be a good time. Trust me on that.
 
Riding a bike feels good to my back generally. Even all day stuff does not bug it nearly as much as a long car ride.

@Mike95060
That is an interesting take and I honestly had never considered being able to do the splits again when I pass. :teeth

For real though using the mind is an effective means for getting some range of motion and stretching success. Getting the CPU to overcome the defensive measures to allow additional range of motion... and relax and do it again works.

It was drilled into me as a young martial artist and I have been doing it in rehab as the therapist stretches me and at home doing the scar tissue stretches that don't qualify as good pain.

I have found it easier to relax when someone else is stretching me vs doing it myself which is interesting.
 
75 now, in my mid 30's got a bulge L4 L5 two injections took care of the big pain. Now if I get a feeling like someone pushing a thumb hard in my left butt cheek I stop what every I am doing. I watch what I lift and that has worked well for 40 years. Our old age friend arthritis has led to two TKR. First one 4 years ago was just about perfect. Second one one year old May 7 not so much. Saw Dr yesterday and he is now looking a possible PT but needs to find a PT that can do a specialized therapy also going to consult with another Dr. He was honest with me was not 100% sure what is causing the pain and my problem with stability, wearing a brace for 6 months. Brace helps and I can ride with it. Left shoulder has arthritis from an injury riding the PSMC mothers day Enduro 1972. Did have a draft physical the following week and failed. Looked at surgery and decided to just live with it. Toss in some trigger finger and the old body let me know it is not young anymore. Still better to keep moving, riding and enjoying life than the alternative.

I do have a friend who has one knee replacement, two hip replacements and one shoulder. He said the most painful replacement by far was his shoulder. Next was his knee and the hip was the least painful to do.
 
I'd suggest getting a full blood panel done and methylation test. Looking for a baseline, but also any vitamin and mineral deficiencies, to start.The key is to get the complete blood panel. Looking for inflammation markers, Liver/ Kidney/ Vitamin D levels, elevated uric acid, etc. All the while, a crusade against inflammation is most important as we age. Peptide markets will be opening up where there's some positive regenerative uses for them. Legalization of known net benefit PT's are on the way, for research reasons. I'd also look to increasing blood oxygenation as much as possible. Regular exercise, diet/ habits, ancillaries. BPC-157 with TB-500 is a good combination of two well known peptides for recovery/ repair of damage tissues using increased oxygen to the injured site. Used by arthritic individuals with positive results.
 
Joe_13 said:
Luckily for me riding my bike is much easier on my back than driving a car believe it or not.
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I agree with this. Riding keeps your core muscles strong, at least on a sportbike it does. Plus the wind helps prop you up anyway. In comparison, the vast majority of car seats suck donkey balls.
 
Bikes certainly can be more comfortable than just sitting. Don’t know about sport bikes but my ST was definitely comfortable when I hurt. This has been noted by others including moto journalists.
 
Lower back due to car accident when young, comes and goes but has been lingering around more the past few years. Hands and feet are numb.

Dad had back surgery, his life like yours. What he said, whatever I do, don't let them go in there. He recently had some more fusing done. That just stresses the adjacent discs.

My old boss, due a mc accident, had his entire neck and upper back fused. He was OK with it. He could sleep sitting straight up in a chair.
 
armchair physio here- strength training (compound exercises using barbell specifically because it can be uniformly loaded) aided with resistance bands will help keep what's already strong and reduce inflammation/aid recovery from existing injury.

usual disclaimer - not a medical advise etc. etc..
 
gixxerjeff said:
Has anyone here been through this?
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I hesitate to give advice on a subject I've managed so poorly. :laughing
I'm still putting off neck surgery due to my experiences with back, hip, shoulder surgeries (among others).
The one thing I've learned after many surgeries is, there's ALWAYS unexpected consequences after a surgery. Usually it's minor things, sometimes more serious, but once in a while your left with a problem as bad as the original problem (or worse). I, unfortunately, traded a problem that caused intermittent pain for one that causes constant pain... and while this is probably uncommon, it definitely can happen.
Also, my recovery from surgery in my sixties is much, much slower than it was 20 or 30 years ago.
In recent months I've been trying to focus more on how I process the pain, as opposed to trying to stop it.
Best of luck to you and I hope you find some relief.
 
One caveat is that when joints have deformed and eroded with degeneration, injury or surgical repair, one can’t just will them or the impacted nerves and other soft tissues into submission. Exercise of whatever type one can handle with progressive adaptation to new moves is good. I love pilates, yoga and many other things like Tai Chi, Qi Gong and others.inflammation has food sources too. Persistence and consistency are key, the 24/7 earth’s gravity will subsume us all someday, but every minute is a battle worth waging to keep on keepin’ on until we are on the underside of the grass.
 
gixxerjeff said:
Has anyone here been through this?
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Extensively.

There may be congenital reasons too, but once upon a time, I had a bad day of snowboarding that left both ends of my spine compressed. Being in my 30's at the time, there was no stenosis yet, but the disks were at about 20% of normal height. Pinched a nerve in the cervical spine, right arm went numb. After six months with no improvement, I saw a chiropractor. A year an a half of treatments 3 days a week, and sensation returned. X-rays showed disks at about 80% or normal height by then.

25 years later, time and gravity did its thing, disk height collapsed and spinal canal narrowed. My left arm went numb. By this time, abnormal bone growth was the issue and no amount of cracking my neck, having something pull on it or rubbing Bengay on it were going to make any difference. After several consultations and different surgical options, I chose a surgery that was pretty invasive, had a long recovery time, but left my spine strong and me able to do everything I was doing before.

Time caught up with my lower back more recently too and I've had two surgeries within 14 months to relieve pressure on nerves there too. The second one was a revision, as the first caused issues that weren't present previously.

The one piece of advice I have that I think trumps everything else: Get MRI imagery. Without it, everyone is just guessing. With it, you'll have a much better idea of what could make a difference and what just gives your spine time to get worse.
 
^^^^^^^
just another epic post from you, Andy......bursting with useable information and insight....as usual......
 
littlebeast said:
pilates. thank me later.
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Agree 100%. If you don't have a strong core, that is where you should start.
Only if that doesn't alleviate the issues should you think of going to surgery, it's always better to keep them from doing irreversible stuff if you can help it.
 
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