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Dying for work

I worked graveyard shift when my kids were really little. 10pm to 6 am, plus a fair amount of OT. I got to get them up in the morning, go on field trips with them in preschool and elementary, spend time in the evening, etc. It was pretty good.
 
It was horrible. My 4-4 schedule was happening when my 1st was a baby. We did what we had to do but it was a burden on my wife and me. We were basically ships passing in the night during the week.

That's not right. This is not good for kids. Not good for health. Not good for family relationships.
 
That's not right. This is not good for kids. Not good for health. Not good for family relationships.

Agreed. This was one of the reasons we moved to New Mexico for a while. I knew that schedule could not last. On the plus side I was in a shop that did amazing work(BIG aerospace parts, the Mars wheel shop) and the experience was important for me so i"m not upset how it played out.
 
I get paid the same salary regardless of how much I work so it works to motivate me to work the least hours possible fort he most pay.
 
I get paid the same salary regardless of how much I work so it works to motivate me to work the least hours possible fort he most pay.

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I'm just saying the truth. And whatever my employers do to "inspire" me suck. They do the absolute wrong thing every time. Threatening me with a bad review for using my mobile during a meeting is not motivating and shows me they're just petty.

Why should I work harder than necessary?
 
I wouldn't have to move, they'd fly me to and from location every rotation.
Would be a dream if it were in San Diego or some such nice place where you could still go out after work but this particular project is NOT at a desirable location. Thus the reason for offering more to go there, just not enough more being offered yet.

mob and demob being to and from the job, not your place of residence.

still seems worth it to me if someone isn't happy with their current gig
there's some work in AK with similar schedules in my line of work. Once was really interested but now it'd not be worth it to me. Mostly because i really like where i'm at (company wise, not location)
 
I work to live, not live to work, but the professional world for some reason demands you at least pretend you love working.
 
I enjoy what i do, doesn't take sitting at home too lomg for me to wnt to go back to work. Not sure if my jobs that great or my vacations are that boring lol
 
I like interviewing clients, performing work papers, following up on issues, interacting with co-workers. I don't even mind my commute. I like and respect my boss and most people in the department.

*I* am the problem. I just don't really care about any of it beyond the fact it pays for my life.

I truly believe most people in most jobs would rather stay at home if given the choice. This idea that we can all have jobs that are both enjoying and fulfilling is as BS as the American dream itself.

And it's not our fault, we were raised on lies and continue to lie to our children. Was it the millenials told by their parents to work hard so they don't need to work at McDonalds who get shit form their parents for not wanting to work at McDonalds?

Baby boomers did such a great job leaving society in great shape for their kids.
 
I like interviewing clients, performing work papers, following up on issues, interacting with co-workers. I don't even mind my commute. I like and respect my boss and most people in the department.

*I* am the problem. I just don't really care about any of it beyond the fact it pays for my life.

I truly believe most people in most jobs would rather stay at home if given the choice. This idea that we can all have jobs that are both enjoying and fulfilling is as BS as the American dream itself.

And it's not our fault, we were raised on lies and continue to lie to our children. Was it the millenials told by their parents to work hard so they don't need to work at McDonalds who get shit form their parents for not wanting to work at McDonalds?

Baby boomers did such a great job leaving society in great shape for their kids.

Nothing ever is.
 
The key for management is to create an environment that you can squeeze as much work as possible out of your workers for as little pay as you can get away with. That is the path to greatest personal pay.

The key for workers is to get paid as much money as you can for as little work time as you can get away with.

Buying into catch phrases that shame or trick you into working much more for less pay is not a smart way to go about a career unless there is an ironclad assurance (tons of asshole managers who will make empty promises with no intentions of following through, just a cheap trick to get more work for less money) that your hard work will be rewarded with higher positions and/or greater salary is simply falling for the BS that gets played against workers.

I think that we're rapidly moving towards a time of worker revolt where people stop eating the BS from managers and start demanding better pay and less hours. The unemployment numbers are low enough for that to happen, people need to stop being sheep and collectively wake up and work together.
 
The key for management is to create an environment that you can squeeze as much work as possible out of your workers for as little pay as you can get away with. That is the path to greatest personal pay.

The key for workers is to get paid as much money as you can for as little work time as you can get away with.

I don't really agree with you here. I think the job of a manager is to create strategies to (1) allocate the smallest amount of human and material resources to a project and (2) to streamline workflows for employees to reduce the volume and complexity of work. Not to mention career development and mentorship.

Maybe some managers obsess over the volume of work, but I'll bet dollars to doughnuts that they don't get quality results.

The culture of working more than 8 hours, not taking vacation, and being on call at home while rejecting personal life, family, and recreation is a result of job insecurity which has steadily increased since the 70s.
 
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I don't really agree with you here. I think the job of a manager is to create strategies to (1) allocate the smallest amount of human and material resources to a project and (2) to streamline workflows for employees to reduce the volume and complexity of work. Not to mention career development and mentorship.

Maybe some managers obsess over the volume of work, but I'll bet dollars to doughnuts that they don't get quality results.

The culture of working more than 8 hours and being on call at home while rejecting personal life, family, and recreation is a result of job insecurity which has steadily increased since the 70s.
What you're describing is what 'good' managers do, when they're given the chance by upper management.

Unfortunately, the majority of managers (and growing) do it the other way, many use fear as their primary driving tool to get productivity. You and I (and many others on here) know that fear quickly degrades into diminishing returns, but shit managers are shit people who don't have the intelligence (and often inclination) to manage in a more effective (long term) manner where people work hard because they enjoy their job and like their manager.
 
What you're describing is what 'good' managers do, when they're given the chance by upper management.

Unfortunately, the majority of managers (and growing) do it the other way, many use fear as their primary driving tool to get productivity. You and I (and many others on here) know that fear quickly degrades into diminishing returns, but shit managers are shit people who don't have the intelligence (and often inclination) to manage in a more effective (long term) manner where people work hard because they enjoy their job and like their manager.

Overall I don't see bad managers and bad upper management surviving much these days. With low unemployment employees can more easily leave bad managers and bad companies.
 
It was horrible. My 4-4 schedule was happening when my 1st was a baby. We did what we had to do but it was a burden on my wife and me. We were basically ships passing in the night during the week.

See, I'd like that schedule better than working typical day hours. I'm currently working a grave shift, 6 pm to 6 am, and I prefer that much more than day shift. I think 6-6 is a little better than 4-4, because you got a couple more afternoon hours to pick up kids from school and see the family, etc. But I could definitely make 4-4 work well for me.

That's not right. This is not good for kids. Not good for health. Not good for family relationships.

It's funny though. A lot depends on one's outlook and personal situation. I find working odd hours, and many times one day of the weekend, can be better for kids and family life. I can pick them up from school, take them if I have to, and attend other school events, for example. Things I might not be able to do on a regular day time week day schedule. Sometimes you might have to miss things, but it balances out with times you're available. Plus, having 3 to 4 days off a week is HUGE in my book.

The most burned out I ever got from work was the 3 years I worked as a detective. At the time, we were scheduled a typical 5/8 schedule with an unpaid lunch, like many working stiffs. I had weekends off, but it was only 2 days and I was used to 3 to 4 days off on shift work. Then, add to that, we were basically on call 24/7, and we're not really compensated appropriately for that burden and responsibility. Many times, it seemed like almost every weekend in the summer times, we'd get called out at night for a major crime and then end up working through the weekend, only to start all over again. Even when you're not called out on a given week, the burden and responsibly of always being on call definitely burned me out. I couldn't hardly have an alcoholic drink when off duty. I couldn't hardly really travel anywhere unless I was on an actual vacation. Speaking of vacations, three times while on a preapproved vacation, I was called out to crime scenes. Once I didn't have to go, as I was literally on the slopes in Tahoe, and the case wasn't a murder. The other two times I was on vacation, but in town, and had to respond to process murder scenes. It was an overall great experience in my career, but I have no desire to do it again. And that is entirely due to the working conditions that burned me out.

I can work more hours per week doing 12-hour graveyard patrol shifts than I worked as a detective and feel much more balanced in a work / life equilibrium. Longer days with more days off, and no burden of being on call 24/7 makes all the difference.

I worked graveyard shift when my kids were really little. 10pm to 6 am, plus a fair amount of OT. I got to get them up in the morning, go on field trips with them in preschool and elementary, spend time in the evening, etc. It was pretty good.

^^^Exactly! :thumbup
 
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I don't really agree with you here. I think the job of a manager is to create strategies to (1) allocate the smallest amount of human and material resources to a project and (2) to streamline workflows for employees to reduce the volume and complexity of work. Not to mention career development and mentorship.

Maybe some managers obsess over the volume of work, but I'll bet dollars to doughnuts that they don't get quality results.

The culture of working more than 8 hours, not taking vacation, and being on call at home while rejecting personal life, family, and recreation is a result of job insecurity which has steadily increased since the 70s.

Not always that. Sometimes, like in my case, you put in time and devotion, and make sacrifices, with goals of moving upward, only to see time and time again that the people being rewarded with promotions haven't done dick.
 
I think that we're rapidly moving towards a time of worker revolt where people stop eating the BS from managers and start demanding better pay and less hours. The unemployment numbers are low enough for that to happen, people need to stop being sheep and collectively wake up and work together.
Won't happen. The wealth gap is so big that most/all of us need to put up with the BS to collect our paycheck. What's the alternative? Gotta pay the bills somehow and in the absence of a union or regulatory body the corporations will only enrich themselves. That's their only purpose.

The culture of working more than 8 hours, not taking vacation, and being on call at home while rejecting personal life, family, and recreation is a result of job insecurity which has steadily increased since the 70s.
We've got the Gigafactory over here. I know several people who work there or interviewed there. The attitude is that it's an amazing privilege to work there but manke no mistake you're going to sign your life away. You WILL be onsite for meetings at 8pm. After your regular 8-6 workday. And be expected to stay and work the 2 hours between. I think most companies today have the same attitude that you should feel lucky to be there.
 
I like interviewing clients, performing work papers, following up on issues, interacting with co-workers. I don't even mind my commute. I like and respect my boss and most people in the department.

*I* am the problem. I just don't really care about any of it beyond the fact it pays for my life.

I truly believe most people in most jobs would rather stay at home if given the choice. This idea that we can all have jobs that are both enjoying and fulfilling is as BS as the American dream itself.

And it's not our fault, we were raised on lies and continue to lie to our children. Was it the millenials told by their parents to work hard so they don't need to work at McDonalds who get shit form their parents for not wanting to work at McDonalds?

Baby boomers did such a great job leaving society in great shape for their kids.

+1
Where you end up is usually predicated on where you begin. I like all this bootstrap BS being tossed around, but before you can pull yourself up by the bootstraps you need boots. Most ppl in this country weren't even born with shoes. They call it the American Dream, because you have to be asleep to believe it.

I quit working as soon as I could (a year before my actual retirement date because I felt I had enough money to get me through till when the checks started coming) and I fucking hate work. Even if I did like my job, I'd still hate having to do it. And if I live long enough to get SS, I'll be pulling more take home pay than when I was working. I'm living marginally right now, but I'd rather do that than get up every day and go to fucking work.
 
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