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Electrician help - Unbiased opinion on changing circuit breaker panel.

Dubbington

Dubbington

Slamdunk Champion
Joined
Jul 15, 2007
Location
East Yay
Moto(s)
EX Street Triple ;(
Name
Dubs
The house we bought in Concord was built in 1965. I’m on the fence on needing to replace the breaker panel.

Online research says I should have replaced it yesterday that it’s a surprise the house hasn’t exploded yet.

My contractor father who does a lot of his own electrical says ‘you’re fine, save the $$’ which isn’t really an endorsement or vote of confidence. A coworkers electrician friend said only replace it if there’s a problem. There hasn’t been.

It’s a Stab-Lok panel. Not sure if it’s made by Federal Pacific Electric.

Non permit swap is about $1200-$2,000 from some local electricians.

I’d like to know if I SHOULD replace it and if so, if there is a way to check why? From my research it’s more a precautionary.

 
I’d say if it supplies the current you need, leave it alone.

Do you have 100 or 200 amp service? We had to upgrade to 200 because we added square footage to our home.
 
Use that as a subpanel and add a new 200 amp meter/main combo on the outside. It's a nice upgrade, and when you get ready to add a hot tub, pool, work shop, etc., you'll be all set.
If you need a referral, I know a guy.
 
However, it doesn’t need to be done now. You have plenty of other things that need to get done before upgrading your electrical service. Get yourself moved in first.
 
Yep, I agree that if it’s working fine leave it alone.
You have bigger fish to fry right now.

Our house was built in 1969 and we had a similar panel.
We replaced it 2 years ago when we couldn’t reset one of the breakers anymore.
 
greenmonster said:
Yep, I agree that if it’s working fine leave it alone.
Click to expand...
Everyone saying this is missing the point with Stab-Lok panels: The failure mode on these things is they don't trip when they need to. You have no way of knowing whether they're working properly or not until they fail to trip and start a fire. Old ones sometimes arc in normal operation and some breakers will fail to break contact when you turn them off.

Many insurers won't insure a building they know has a Stab-Lok panel. If you have a house fire that is traced back to one of these panels, your carrier could refuse to pay out. This can and does happen.

A building I worked in several years ago had a Stab-Lok panel. We had a number of issues with the thing and I know for sure some breakers were not tripping when they were severely overloaded. We were after the landlord for some time to replace the panel, but he kept dragging his feet. When the fire marshal came out for an inspection, he saw the panel and it was replaced the following week.
 
If the OP hasn’t closed the sale yet, they should get an estimate for the cost of replacing the panel and be compensated in the final accounting.
 
Maybe I got lucky with mine but all my neighbors had, and in many case still have, the same old panel and there haven’t been any house fires at all in our area.
And we’ve lived here 20 years.

Yes, the risk is real with those old panels. Just relaying my personal experience.
 
I replaced my Zinsco panel when I measured 29 amps running through a breaker rated for 20 amps. The circuit wasn't even fully loaded and I realized we had been pulling higher loads through it. House didn't burn down, but it was clear that at least one of the breakers was failing to do the one thing it was installed to do.

I took the opportunity to increase the panel size, add a generator feed and gain an extra 25 amps capacity, matching PG@E's rating for their cable in the dirt.

Flip
 
Yes, when you install your new meter/main panel you can add a generator interlock so when the power goes out you can safely connect your generator directly to the panel to power your essential items. :thumbup
 
tzrider said:
Everyone saying this is missing the point with Stab-Lok panels: The failure mode on these things is they don't trip when they need to. You have no way of knowing whether they're working properly or not until they fail to trip and start a fire. Old ones sometimes arc in normal operation and some breakers will fail to break contact when you turn them off.

Many insurers won't insure a building they know has a Stab-Lok panel. If you have a house fire that is traced back to one of these panels, your carrier could refuse to pay out. This can and does happen.

A building I worked in several years ago had a Stab-Lok panel. We had a number of issues with the thing and I know for sure some breakers were not tripping when they were severely overloaded. We were after the landlord for some time to replace the panel, but he kept dragging his feet. When the fire marshal came out for an inspection, he saw the panel and it was replaced the following week.
Click to expand...
71254377557__C2EE80CD-EC5A-4A1B-B93D-D87A9F9F5213.jpeg

Good old Stab-Lock almost burned my house down. My home owners insurance covered about 2/3 of replacing the panel. IMHO, replacing a Stab-Lock panel should be a priority.
IMG_2360.jpeg


Just to put a finer point on it. If I hadn’t been home, awake and curious about why the lights were flickering, I would have had a house fire. A Stab-Lock panel WILL fail eventually. Mine appeared fine until it was arcing. I lived in the house for years with no problems. And then the mess you see above happened in minutes.

Replace the panel Dubbs.
 
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Well, you will probably have to replace the panel in 2027 or after when your gas water heater and/or your gas fired furnace go "kuput".
New stuff will need 220-240 volt service.
 
We reside in an HOA. Insurance companies are demanding that suspect boxes be replaced. We had a reputable electrical contractor inspect all the units. Many failed.

Modern homes have far more draw on systems than what their home was designed regarding electrical loads. If you have identified a panel as suspect, replace it.

Scenario: you tell your insurance company after
your home burns to the ground that you knew
of the danger but you were getting this instead...
il_300x300.5570872503_mdv7.jpg
 
Yeah, I'd replace it ASAP just for peace of mind.

In the grand scheme of things, where $10k home insurance rates are common it is a small investment.
 
My go to electrician in Concord is Got Watts. Jeremy runs the company and is a top notch dude. Honest to a fault. Put in a whole house fan, two rounds of solar, panel swap, and wired 1/2 the house for a remodel. I insisted on using GotWatts when the house got renovated by another contractor. He's worked all over our area and is and knows the issues inherent in this area.
 
Dubbington said:
The house we bought in Concord was built in 1965. I’m on the fence on needing to replace the breaker panel.

Online research says I should have replaced it yesterday that it’s a surprise the house hasn’t exploded yet.

My contractor father who does a lot of his own electrical says ‘you’re fine, save the $$’ which isn’t really an endorsement or vote of confidence. A coworkers electrician friend said only replace it if there’s a problem. There hasn’t been.

It’s a Stab-Lok panel. Not sure if it’s made by Federal Pacific Electric.

Non permit swap is about $1200-$2,000 from some local electricians.

I’d like to know if I SHOULD replace it and if so, if there is a way to check why? From my research it’s more a precautionary.

Click to expand...
The electrician said “ you’re lucky the house didn’t catch on fire”
This panel was replaced with a surface mounted panel on the outside of the house. Including a new drop that was done just outside of the building through the eaves of the roof.
We also installed a new subpanel to feed the house and use some of the wiring in the existing panel and connections as a junction box.
This was a 1952 build.
Yeah, looks kind of bad don’t you think?
Geez
PaulR
🤪
 

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Just saw the comment regarding the permit.
I permitted this with PG&E through the electrical contractor. Not a problem they know how to handle that definitely worth getting a permit.
Just my two cents…
 
Our old house in San Jose was built in 1962, with a Bulldog PushMatic 100A panel and breakers. When we sold it in 2024 it was inspected by our agent's inspector and the buyer's inspector - neither one thought that old PushMatic system was an issue...I had replaced all the breakers back in 2022 with rebuilt ones - that is all that's available now, at exhorbitant prices!
 
Stabloc, pushmatic, zinsco, challenger, federal Pacific and fused panels were all "mandatory panel replacement" red flagged at my old solar company.


Made the salespeople angry because it killed a lot of sales, but there was good reason we didn't want to own the liability for those.
 
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