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Engine/Compression Braking, Why???

Trailbraking is uselfull in 180 degree corners, I find. Sears 7 and 11 are great for it, as corner speed is limited by the tightness of the turns. In fact, it's easy to run a diamond patter in 7, and while not able to carry the corner speed, my entry and exit are much faster than a traditonal apex...

Trailbraking is done only with the fronts. The rear is used on some of these turns, but that's only to pivot and slow the rear from rising too high off the ground (cause the rear wheel, once off the ground, acts like a gyro, carrying the back of the bike higher faster). The rear brake really doesn't slow a bike much, but does aid in control. This was one of my important lessons this season. Really good one too!

Trail braking allows deeper braking, but at the expense of the contact patch safety margin. Trail too hard, too deep and the possibility to overload the suspension becomes high. Anyone see Nichy Haden Tuck the front at VIR? Not quite the reason, but close...

The real problem with trailing it in is the difficulty to steer the bike without putting it on the gorund. At some point, there has to be a decision to let off the brake and get on the gas. If you guys get into trouble, yell at yourself in your helmet "GASSSSSS" and do it. It'll save your asses more than once!
 
Holeshot said:
If you guys get into trouble, yell at yourself in your helmet "GASSSSSS" and do it. It'll save your asses more than once!
Click to expand...

Hey! I thought I was the only one who did that. Do you also yell out what gear you're in when you shift? Man, that was the coolest tip I've ever been given.
Saves forgetting what gear I'm in and accidently shifting down to 1st for T11 at Sears Point.

The 1st gear on my bike is really only good for going "SPROING!" off the line when the green flag flies.

T7 is a good place for trail braking, but T4 is too. But that might just be because I'm a big weenie and hate going through T4 fast.

I should also point out that Code doesn't want us trail braking. Our mission, according to him, is to be doing nothing except gently rolling on the throttle through the entire turn, i.e. Brake, select gear, get into position, finish braking, turn in, roll on gently.

I try, I try.

Chris.
www.ZoomZoomTrackDays.com
 
Yeah, thanks for yet another tip Chris. I also cross train yelling directions to myself in my helmet by doing it when I'm getting busy with a new hussy! They get scared, but eventually they get into it!!!! JK

That's a good tip on the gears. I'm gonna use that.

And screw Keith Code. Racing is much different than "running around at a trackday"....
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Are we talking STREET or TRACK?

Smoothie said:

No doubt!

From what I've read, trail braking is accomplished when entering a turn by applying the throttle while still on the front brake. This encourages the rear to spin up and keeps the suspension loaded. As more lean is achieved, less braking is used and the suspension should stay compressed through the exit of the turn. I have also read that this is not the fastest way to go through a turn, but it is used as a tactic to gain position in a race. When trail braking deep into a turn you can stuff someone who otherwise has a faster line.

Let me stress, this is what I've read - not what I have ever done. Maybe Chris can help me out or correct me here.
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I had to come back to this. Please, no one take this advice to heart....

This is a great demonstration of BAD advice...
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Are we talking STREET or TRACK?

Holeshot said:


I had to come back to this. Please, no one take this advice to heart....

This is a great demonstration of BAD advice...
Click to expand...
No Holeshot,
Sadly, I'm not kidding. Like I said, it's not something I DO it's something I've READ. Apparently I read some crap. Thanks for clearing it up - unless you are full of it too.:laughing
 
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Are we talking STREET or TRACK?

Smoothie said:
No Holeshot,
Sadly, I'm not kidding. Like I said, it's not something I DO it's something I've READ. Apparently I read some crap. Thanks for clearing it up - unless you are full of it too.:laughing
Click to expand...

LOL!
 
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Are we talking STREET or TRACK?

Smoothie said:
No Holeshot,
Sadly, I'm not kidding. Like I said, it's not something I DO it's something I've READ. Apparently I read some crap. Thanks for clearing it up - unless you are full of it too.:laughing
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HAHA! Nah, I just run around the Maisto Toy motorcycle models around on my desk and write down what I think I see...it's helped my laptimes like no tomorrow!

Bleeding the brakes on those little things is a bitch though!
 
i think often people overlook how the brakes and the act of braking can either upset or stabilize the bike, this would be truwe going in a straight line and even in a turn. everyone rides differently and even cornering habits vary a lot.

by applying either the front brake in a turn you can greatly affect the level of traction one wheel has over the other. some folks trailbrke in a turn and that can actually stabilize the front at times while others chooseto use the front brakes in a turn which can be very effective when done by a skilled rider.

there is ideal braking and such but when you are on the track and not running in front often you have to change your style of riding to accomodate those around you which means you are pretty much forced to take the sum of the riders around you and come up with your own techniques around turns. always depends on the situation.

when i was racing the 125 gp bike often into turns we'd brake so hard the back of our bikes would be in the air going into the turns and other times i would trail brake into turns when i was coming up on someone during practice or race.

at the same time all of this depends on the bike and the rider. if i was not comfortable with the braking on the 125 i would not have been braking so hard but the bike is so light and managable that its eady to brake and roll a bit on the front wheel before just prior to setting up for the apex ofthe turn.

on a 125 we also kept on the gas in turns to keep the cylinder wet as well. no engine braking basically but sure is a blast to ride.

i guess on the road you take the conditions you have, how good yoru tires are and how familiar you are with the road to know what to do in case you go in too hot?

john
 
Holeshot said:
Yeah, thanks for yet another tip Chris. I also cross train yelling directions to myself in my helmet by doing it when I'm getting busy with a new hussy! They get scared, but eventually they get into it!!!! JK
Click to expand...

Yeah, my one complains that I hurt her right ear when I get "on the throttle" ;)
 
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