• There has been a recent cluster of spammers accessing BARFer accounts and posting spam. To safeguard your account, please consider changing your password. It would be even better to take the additional step of enabling 2 Factor Authentication (2FA) on your BARF account. Read more here.

Recessed lighting: Educamate me!

m_asim

m_asim

Coitus Infinitum
Joined
Mar 25, 2004
Location
LA, CA
Moto(s)
Stephanie (she is a Kawasaki)
So I got this in my noggin to install recessed lighting all over since the rugrat is pulling on (and bringing down) anything that is on the floor. After much deliberation, I settled on getting LED lights.

Unfortunately the more I read up on it, the more I get confused since the prices are all over the place - from $30 to $600 per light :wtf And variables like which dimmers don't have a constant buzzing sound, the light angle (I want to have diffused as compared to task lighting), the can assemblies, the bulbs which allow for more realistic color reproduction, assemblies that work with insulation etc etc.

Arghhhh.

018_fry-argh-1.gif
 
Might not make much sense to do a lighting remodel just to prevent junior pulling on cords. An alternative would be to use a childproof outlet cover and a wire mould to run along the baseboard and up wall so he doesn't have anything to grab. On the LED issue be sure to choose proper color temp range. 3200K would be good. See Kitchler or Tech Lighting products. Or visit a high end lighting store not Home Depot for more ideas.
 
FWIW, go to Home Depot and check out some of their flat panels that fit over existing boxes. I installed some in my kitchen. 1 by 1 or 1 by 2 feet. They throw a LOT of light and are much cheaper to install If you have existing boxes.

Recessed cans can be very expensive to retrofit, and if it's a Title 24 envelope ( insulated ) even more so. If you don't have the wiring in you can easily spend $150-$500 a hole, depending on the circumstances.

I recommend 2700k for residential lighting ( close to warm white) 3200 LED's are a bit harsh for a comfort room, maybe better in a kitchen. They do throw more light.

Use dimmer recommended by the LED manufacturer and don't buy cheap LED buy Cree or better. You will always have a bit of noise with low voltage dimmers, but as you get older your ears will turn to shit and you won't be able to hear the high pitch humming, so just use ear plugs in teh interim.

LED's are the future, incandescents are going away forever, and fluors behind them.
 
Last edited:
Putting in a bunch of cans is a major remodel job. It would not make financial sense unless you have easy access to the space above. We just put in a couple in our bathrooms and it required new framing and dry wall work even though the power was already there.
 
Thanks guys. I don't have LEDs in this old house so it won't be retrofit but brand new installs. Don't want to go the cheaper Halogen route as then I will have to worry about power and heating.
 
russ69 said:
Putting in a bunch of cans is a major remodel job. It would not make financial sense unless you have easy access to the space above. We just put in a couple in our bathrooms and it required new framing and dry wall work even though the power was already there.
Click to expand...

Absolutely. The title 24 insulated ceiling cans (IC) can be huge, and typically retrofit ( cut in ) cans are not IC.
 
Home depot carries retrofit IC cans for like $15 a can. I put a bunch of them in a few years ago. Its very easy if you have a crawl space and an existing ceiling fixture. Harder without, but still doable for a determined lay person.
 
My advice would be to buy only known name brand materials. You're going to pay more, but you're going to get more.

Just out of curiosity, I've been buying a bunch of different stuff whenever I need to replace a light and I've found that the cheaper stuff isn't the color the packages say they are, they're not as bright as they say they are, and they fail much,much,much sooner then they say they will.
 
Is this an appropriate place for a micro-rant about the remaining stock of incandescent bulbs?

Bought a few last month since they're cheap, and our place is a rental on a shitty remote corner of the power grid. CFL's last a few months here, at best. Get the package, looking over the wattage, lumens, and expected lifespan at 3 hours/day. And the last number...

0.7 years.

Yeah.

At three hours a day of usage, these little pieces of shit are expected to last an average of 255 days.

750 hours.

If left on continuously, their mean lifespan will be barely over a MONTH.

:wtf :mad
 
boney said:
My advice would be to buy only known name brand materials. You're going to pay more, but you're going to get more.

Just out of curiosity, I've been buying a bunch of different stuff whenever I need to replace a light and I've found that the cheaper stuff isn't the color the packages say they are, they're not as bright as they say they are, and they fail much,much,much sooner then they say they will.
Click to expand...

My advice as an electrical contractor with forty years in the field is to buy good stuff. Shop and get it wholesale. Cheap LED's are not worth buying. Cheap fluors are seldom worth buying. Cheap incandescents are not worth buying. I can't remember how many times I've been called to replace a recessed ceiling fixture bulb, because they bought cheap stuff and after a few months the heat separates the globe from the edison base and the base remains in the socket when the bulb comes out.
 
cycle61 said:
Is this an appropriate place for a micro-rant about the remaining stock of incandescent bulbs?

Bought a few last month since they're cheap, and our place is a rental on a shitty remote corner of the power grid. CFL's last a few months here, at best. Get the package, looking over the wattage, lumens, and expected lifespan at 3 hours/day. And the last number...

0.7 years.

Yeah.

At three hours a day of usage, these little pieces of shit are expected to last an average of 255 days.

750 hours.

If left on continuously, their mean lifespan will be barely over a MONTH.

:wtf :mad
Click to expand...

Nick:

Get halogens they last longer, also any incandescent on a dimmer will last MUCH longer, I've got an entry light on a dimmer that has used one bulb in 25 years. The more it is dimmed the longer it lasts. 30-40% dimming and you'll extend the life to thousands of hours.
 
I'm pretty sure the last couple years of incandescent bulbs have run thinner and thinner filaments to meet watts per lumen standards, which dramatically decreases bulb life.

We're gradually shifting over to LED's, the two best lights in the house have the Phillips bulbs with the weird yellow and gray construction, but they come on instantly, bright, and consistent color. Lasted over a year up off Zayante Canyon, and now here by Mt Rainier. :)
 
afm199 said:
FWIW, go to Home Depot and check out some of their flat panels that fit over existing boxes. I installed some in my kitchen. 1 by 1 or 1 by 2 feet. They throw a LOT of light and are much cheaper to install If you have existing boxes.

Recessed cans can be very expensive to retrofit, and if it's a Title 24 envelope ( insulated ) even more so. If you don't have the wiring in you can easily spend $150-$500 a hole, depending on the circumstances.

I recommend 2700k for residential lighting ( close to warm white) 3200 LED's are a bit harsh for a comfort room, maybe better in a kitchen. They do throw more light.

Use dimmer recommended by the LED manufacturer and don't buy cheap LED buy Cree or better. You will always have a bit of noise with low voltage dimmers, but as you get older your ears will turn to shit and you won't be able to hear the high pitch humming, so just use ear plugs in teh interim.

LED's are the future, incandescents are going away forever, and fluors behind them.
Click to expand...

Thanks AFM. I have barely-functioning flour fixtures in my kitchen. Despite changing ballasts, switches, etc, there has been a problem getting them to come on since the day we moved in.

I saw those Pixi products (square light panels). I assume those are of decent quality????

I was gonna do cans and I have done the old-incand. kind years ago. It's not that bad of a task. But now that I'm old, the idea of clambering around in the attic is way less attractive. I would love to use existing receptacles....
 
Bay Arean said:
Thanks AFM. I have barely-functioning flour fixtures in my kitchen. Despite changing ballasts, switches, etc, there has been a problem getting them to come on since the day we moved in.

I saw those Pixi products (square light panels). I assume those are of decent quality????

I was gonna do cans and I have done the old-incand. kind years ago. It's not that bad of a task. But now that I'm old, the idea of clambering around in the attic is way less attractive. I would love to use existing receptacles....
Click to expand...

Not sure I remember the name. Home Depot, one foot square, about $75 for the small one. I used two small ones and one 2 foot long one in my kitchen. Good stuff.
 
Thanks Mr. White. Ernie, I wish you were closer then I'd have you do the job properly instead of me dicking around with stuff I don't know. Not feeling comfortable with wiring in the attic and the risk of fire (may be it is in my head).

P.S. What would be a good place to get them parts wholesale?
 
m_asim said:
Thanks Mr. White. Ernie, I wish you were closer then I'd have you do the job properly instead of me dicking around with stuff I don't know. Not feeling comfortable with wiring in the attic and the risk of fire (may be it is in my head).

P.S. What would be a good place to get them parts wholesale?
Click to expand...

Somewhere within a twenty mile radius there is a Chinese owned electrical supply house. Look for one with the parking lot full.
 
afm199 said:
Somewhere within a twenty mile radius there is a Chinese owned electrical supply house. Look for one with the parking lot full.
Click to expand...

Let me hit up my Chinese friends. China town ought to have one such store. I usually use them for kitchen cabinets and countertops.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top