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Riders Share (peer to peer motorcycle sharing) write-up

ctwo said:
[ideology]For the owner to be found liable, wouldn't they have to be found negligent of some related cause of loss?
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Lawyers never carpet bomb when they initially file a case...never. I know two people that have been paralyzed in motorcycle accidents and in both cases medical bills alone exceeded $2,000,000.

It occurs to me that this peer to peer sharing is fine if you have no assets but if you actually have something to lose like a house it's a bad idea.
 
So, riders share has liability, but what about comprehensive, collision, etc, if something gets broken on the bike (like dropped) while being rented?

Does the owner of the bike have the clean/clear CA title? Does his/her insurance company know about the rideshare program? (seems like a lot of ins. companies are asking about it now, if their customers drive for rideshare programs)

Are there any gaps in coverage between Riders Share and the bike owners' coverage? This is where I'd really want to know the details - cars might get a parking lot ding or scratch but most rental / ride share situations are incident-free, but a bike can get some pretty significant damage done even just being bumped in a parking lot or dropped at a stop - who fixes that?

I'm curious about the possibilities (making back some $$ on your moto if it sits during the week, etc), but it seems like there's a lot of uncharted territory from a legality / insurance process right now - same with the Bird scooters, IMHO.
 
bpw said:
List vehicle owners as an additional insured on the policy maybe? That's how most Marinas deal with boats (as you well know).

Would still result in both the vehicle owner and Riders Share only having a combined 300k of coverage though. Even worse if a couple accidents happened at the same time since it is an aggregate policy. I wonder how they plan to deal with having a claim early in the year? Buy more insurance or just hope for the best until the new year? The vehicle owners would have no idea if Riders Share had already burned through the 300k of coverage on another claim already.

You know more about this stuff than I do though.
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Good protection for property but oy vey the liability of someone RENTING your motorcycle harming themselves or others.
 
Thought about it just recently after coming back from Denmark/Crete/Paris trip and rented bikes in all locations heck on Crete I rented 2 different bikes ( will start a separate topic on Riding there as it was better than Bay Area).
Now I have 2 amazing bikes that woulnt mind renting out to folks ....if the price is right.

Now a really stupid question. You are all talking about liability insurance....can you describe a scenario where I will be liable for renters injuries or death ?

Wouldnt a waiver where you explain that you are not responsible for injuries or death protect you ?
 
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gixxerjeff said:
Paging Surj (I'm beginning to sound like a broken record :laughing)
This was covered in City Bike recently. (June issue, iirc)
Frankly, I'll be surprised if it takes off.
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:laughing :thumbup It was April. Article on Twisted Road here.

I don't have time to read that whole thing right now, but I have to chuckle at the notion of EBITDA  in this context. :laughing

In addition to Twisted Road, I interviewed and photographed Guillermo from Riders Share. I have not completed / run that story yet, because the insurance situation is constantly evolving, both in terms of machine / damage coverage, and liability. That's coming soon, but I haven't put a date on it yet.

I am, however, renting a bike from Twisted Road this month, as part of another story.

That's a whole lot of "stay tuned" (other than the article linked above) but that's all I'm comfortable saying right now, at least until Jeff pages me in another thread. :laughing
 
mitiasbikes said:
Now a really stupid question. You are all talking about liability insurance....can you describe a scenario where I will be liable for renters injuries or death ?

Wouldnt a waiver where you explain that you are not responsible for injuries or death protect you ?
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Any situation where anyone gets hurt can get you sued. Waiver might help you win the case, but it won't stop them from suing.

Plus, you can't waive your right to sue over negligence. Have you maintained your bikes 100% in keeping with the manufacturers maintenance schedule and do you have records to prove it? Do you have records of an ongoing safety/maintenance check before you rent bikes? Is the person doing the maintenance qualified to work on bikes?

Even if you win, lawyers are expensive and that is part of why insurance is so important since the insurance company has lots of them and will be fighting on your side if they have skin in the game.
 
Right, what you need may not so much be liability insurance, as much as lawsuit insurance. Just getting the case thrown out of court can be expensive.

The most basic issue is that engaging in this activity can potentially subject you to the court system, no matter what insurance you have, no matter what any body signed, no matter how perfect your bike is, no matter how much they paid you.

This is a "cost of doing business", and whether that cost is worth the revenue you're getting is question you'll need to ask yourself (and your lawyer).

I mean, minimally, don't listen to yahoo's like us on the inter webs, take the agreements you signed with Rider Share, take the agreements that the renters sign, and head over to your friendly, family lawyer and say "what kind of exposure do I have here", and see what they say. Ideally they'll say "I haven't the slightest idea" and refer you to a more specialized attorney that can answer it. If it's something that interesting to you, it should be worth a couple hundred bucks to get clarified by a CA attorney.

Ideally, Rider Share has "thought of all of this", but who knows? It is in their interest to protect YOU, as a provider, since, without you, they have no business. But, their first prerogative is to protect themselves.

So, you know, go get it checked out.

..and let us know what you find out!
 
Also, just found out that both Riders Share and Twisted Road take 30% from your rental price. Seems kind of high and at that price I would expect much better insurance coverage on their end then stated.
 
mitiasbikes said:
Thought about it just recently after coming back from Denmark/Crete/Paris trip and rented bikes in all locations heck on Crete I rented 2 different bikes ( will start a separate topic on Riding there as it was better than Bay Area).
Now I have 2 amazing bikes that woulnt mind renting out to folks ....if the price is right.

Now a really stupid question. You are all talking about liability insurance....can you describe a scenario where I will be liable for renters injuries or death ?

Wouldnt a waiver where you explain that you are not responsible for injuries or death protect you ?
Click to expand...

Waivers are worth the paper they're written on. You can't be protected from negligence. Suppose the chain breaks, locks up the rear wheel at 70 mph and spits the rider into the front of a semi? The first thing the insurance company will look in to is how was the chain maintained, what kind of training did the person who maintained the chain have, who manufactured the chain, what kind of training did the person who installed the chain have, ....... See where I'm going? Everyone of those people are going to get a subpoena and have to testify. Everyone of those people are going to be named in the civil suit. I'm not a lawyer but I've owned my business for 24 years and every single day I have to balance my exposure to liability to the value of the work I do.
 
I have my MV Agusta on rider share. Lots of interest but no one has pulled the trigger.

They like to make you free safe as a renter but honestly I’m a little concerned and here’s why.

A month ago I lent Erin my sports car. She quickly proceeded to put it into a concrete barrier while taking a turn and totaled the car.

Thankfully she is ok.

What sucks is in CA isurqnce follows the vehicle not the person. What that means is at the end of the day my insurance was affected and now I get to pay an additional 340 per year for something that wasn’t my fault. I wasn’t even in the car!

Now translate that into lending your bike out. If someone puts it into a building guess who’s on the hook? That’s right, you are! My insurance wanted to know if the concrete barrier was damaged. They told me I’d be on the hook for it.

With everything that has happened I’m no longer interested in renting out any vehicle.
 
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Entoptic said:
I have my MV Agusta on rider share. Lots of interest but no one has pulled the trigger.

They like to make you free safe as a renter but honestly I’m a little concerned and here’s why.

A month ago I lent Erin my sports car. She quickly proceeded to put it into a concrete barrier while taking a turn and totaled the car.

Thankfully she is ok.

What sucks is in CA isurqnce follows the vehicle not the person. What that means is at the end of the day my insurance was affected and now I get to pay an additional 340 per year for something that wasn’t my fault. I wasn’t even in the car!

Now translate that into lending your bike out. If someone puts it into a building guess who’s on the hook? That’s right, you are! My insurance wanted to know if the concrete barrier was damaged. They told me I’d be on the hook for it.

With everything that has happened I’m no longer interested in renting out any vehicle.
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It would be even worse, at least your insurance covered Erin's crash. If your bike is rented your normally policy is very likely void.
 
Neat idea.

But like every car I'd actually want to rent on those car renting services, the cost is extreme. (People suggesting I rent a Tesla or a Porsche off some car rental service forget that I don't have $500+/day to spend on a simple car rental) $300/day for an S1000RR - although I did see one for closer to $130 but it looked a bit more... salvage title, let's say.

And it's definitely not a "sharing" economy. It's a "rental" economy.
 
I would do it, but the part about where they touch my motorcycle is a deal-breaker.
 
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