School me on generators

[budman]

The Mrs is now onboard with a small generator for home use.

Thinking this one but really don't have much of a clue.

What say ye BARF??

 

[ST Guy]

I much prefer Honda generators as they are super reliable. Yes, they are more expensive but I don’t see a generator as anything to try and save money on. And they are the quietist as well.

 

[Sharxfan]

Ah so you are going the whole home route nice. First you have to figure out what your watt usage is going to be for all appliances you plan on using during the outage especially with automatic cutoff as it will just switchover load be damned. Once you get that figured out you get the appropriate sized generator for your house and let the install it and away you go. Hopefully your electrical panel is close to an outside wall so it would be easier to wire it up. Mine is all the way in the middle of the house so I use an external generator hookup with mains cutoff switch outside. During an outage I go to the inside breaker box flip all unnecessary breakers off and then go outside power up the gennie. hit the cutover switch and then plug in the 60amp extension cord from switch to gennie and I am ready to go in 10 minutes using all my house outlets with not extension cords in the house. can't run as many things as a n ice whole house one but have it dialed in so that I can be comfortable. Also have no municipal gas here so if I did get a whole house it would probably kill my propane tank in a day or two and that can be expensive at the wrong time of year.

The only thing I have heard is that it's hard to get parts for the air cooled whole house generators and they also mention life span is not as long as say water cooled ones but I think the water cooled ones are larger and cost way more.

 

[budman]

Yes.. good news is the main is right outside and the generator would go in a light well adjacent. Not to bad other than exposed conduit to get down. I assume I can look at the main and as long as it can handle the amps I would be good.

For sure install and forget (for the most part). We use Generac's for many of my projects and clients love them. I just don't have much experience with smaller ones.

 

[Dmitriy]

Get a harbor freight predator 3500 (if you want 'small') its quiet and lasts forever by most peoples accounts.
(if you want to use natural gas you may need a different generator / hookup)

I highly recommend pairing the said generator with a lithium battery bank so you don't have to run it continuously unless you are using all of your appliances.

(you can also get yourself a nice little transfer switch that sits underneath the power meter.... https://www.central.coop/generlink-transfer-switch)

 

[berth]

Well, when I priced generators, for me, after all of the work they needed to do (electrical, running gas line, etc.), batteries cost the same, so I got batteries with my solar panels.

Really happy I did that.

 

[Dmitriy]

Well, when I priced generators, for me, after all of the work they needed to do (electrical, running gas line, etc.), batteries cost the same, so I got batteries with my solar panels.

Really happy I did that.

If you have solar it is absolutely better to have a buffer battery system to battle PG&E's time of use pricing.

 

[Enchanter]

Don't get a portable. Have one permanently installed, hardwired to the house, powered by CNG. You're not going to want to carry or roll it out and plug it into the meter when the power goes out. You're going to hate going to get gas for it too. You owe it to yourself to relax in your senior years .

I have the literbike of portable generators. It can power the entire house. It's a pain in the ass to roll out and roll back in. It will run for 16hrs on a full tank (6.6gal), but it still sucks having to refuel it. I have to change the oil every 50hrs (get a service contract).

 

[Kornholio]

Whole house is the way to go and you want the ATS as part of the deal too. I'd also get the Kohler dealer (used to run a branch's service department) to throw in some annual services.

 

[ThumperX]

Agree with "whole house" you can even have an auto switch installed in case power goes out while you are away.

I have a Predator 9000 inverter that is super easy to roll around and quiet; but it's gas fueled monster and that is not great for your application.
The generic multifuels are being used all over Maarin.

 

[bikeama]

The ATS is a must have. Depending on your budget you can run everything or have a side subpanel with just some of the circuits.

 

[Sharxfan]

Don't get a portable. Have one permanently installed, hardwired to the house, powered by CNG. You're not going to want to carry or roll it out and plug it into the meter when the power goes out. You're going to hate going to get gas for it too. You owe it to yourself to relax in your senior years .

I have the literbike of portable generators. It can power the entire house. It's a pain in the ass to roll out and roll back in. It will run for 16hrs on a full tank (6.6gal), but it still sucks having to refuel it. I have to change the oil every 50hrs (get a service contract).

Best thing I did last year was get a transfer pump for my gas cans. holy shit was that thing a game changer. I got a highly rated one from amazon and it works amazeballs. I use it for the generator and to fill up my lawnmower every weekend. I just make sure to take out the crappy alkaline batteries after I use it so there is no chance of battery corrosion although thinking about getting AA lithium so I won't even have to worry about that. Also have a cheap HF backup one I snagged for $7 buck during one of their many sales.

So from June 1st to the end of November I have 50 gallons of gas on hand at all times in case we get hit. I rotate the cans and use them in my lawnmower during this time and then refill as used so I always have pretty fresh gas and then at the end of the hurricane/lawnmower season I then use the handy dandy transfer pumps to transfer gas into my vehicles until it is all gone. rinse and repeat for the last 4 years and counting.

portables aren't that bad for me but a whole house would be nice if I could make it work and had supplied CNG at the casa. If you buy a portable gennie remember the normal ones put out dirty power and are not good for electronics and also cause UPS to have issues if they are drained and recharging. Inverter style ones are better for cleaner power I believe but are also pricey for same wattage.

Like I mentioned earlier I can have my house switched over in ~10 minutes and that is moving it from the garage to the front porch and switching everything over. Plenty of practice getting it done down here in the swamps. Also if doing it like me a cutover switch is a necessity as you don't want to back feed the grid to avoid electrocuting lineman during a power outage if they need to work on poles.

 

[cheez]

Don't get a portable. Have one permanently installed, hardwired to the house, powered by CNG. You're not going to want to carry or roll it out and plug it into the meter when the power goes out. You're going to hate going to get gas for it too. You owe it to yourself to relax in your senior years .

I have the literbike of portable generators. It can power the entire house. It's a pain in the ass to roll out and roll back in. It will run for 16hrs on a full tank (6.6gal), but it still sucks having to refuel it. I have to change the oil every 50hrs (get a service contract).

If you go this route, make sure the genset you buy supports dual fuel, and that you have a connection point for propane. If you are CNG (natural gas) and there's an earthquake which disrupts CNG supply lines, you'll want to be able to fuel it with propane. The Generacs all support that, but they aren't all plumbed for it, so make sure the model you choose is a "dual fuel" model with a separate connection suitable for propane, and then you'll want a 10gal or bigger tank of propane for emergencies.

+1 with the "Get the ATS, get the auto-start setup, get it plumbed in, etc." feedback. The less hassle it is to get started, the less time you'll spend sitting in the dark waiting going "Will PG&E restore it before I can get the genset going?" Nothing sucks more than the effort of dragging out the portable genset, getting your critical loads all on extension cords to it, etc. and having just finished when the power comes back on. Making it no-effort means power goes out, genset starts up, and the lights come back on automatically. Add batteries for bridge time and you don't even lose the lights.

 

[budman]

Thanks all for the input. Definately looking for built in.

Plenty of good stuff above to analyze. Appreciate it!

 

[dtrides]

Dennis-
Here are some of my thoughts after living with generators for a number of years in a less than stable power area .
I would recommend a whole house ( not just some of the circuits) if it's in the budget.
If you have any 220v loads , A/C, laundry dryer , heat, cooking etc, you will need more than a basic system. The smaller systems tend to be 110 V, single phase.
How dependable is the power in your area? How long of power outage do you want to prepare for?
If you anticipate running the generator days on end, you probably want a water cooled unit.
If it is just to cover the occasional outage , air cooled is probably fine.
Do you have Natural Gas or Propane?
If propane, you might think about getting a dedicated tank just for your gen.
That way you will always be prepared and if you do have an extended outage and can't get your tank refilled , you still might have propane for heat and cooking in the other tank. Ran into that living on the mountain for for a few years.
My experience is to go one size bigger than you think you need.
DT

 

[Sharxfan]

Dennis-
Here are some of my thoughts after living with generators for a number of years in a less than stable power area .
I would recommend a whole house ( not just some of the circuits) if it's in the budget.
If you have any 220v loads , A/C, laundry dryer , heat, cooking etc, you will need more than a basic system. The smaller systems tend to be 110 V, single phase.
How dependable is the power in your area? How long of power outage do you want to prepare for?
If you anticipate running the generator days on end, you probably want a water cooled unit.
If it is just to cover the occasional outage , air cooled is probably fine.
Do you have Natural Gas or Propane?
If propane, you might think about getting a dedicated tank just for your gen.
That way you will always be prepared and if you do have an extended outage and can't get your tank refilled , you still might have propane for heat and cooking in the other tank. Ran into that living on the mountain for for a few years.
My experience is to go one size bigger than you think you need.
DT

awesome advice here. because we went into this knowing we could have multi-day outage events we have our stove and water heater setup to use gas so it only takes a spark to get it running and then it doesn't use anymore electricity so we could get away with a smaller portable unit and still be able to cook and have hot water. Also tankless water heater so no constant gas draw to keep a tank warm.

 

[NATEWA]

I would recommend you talk to someone who is living off grid or lives in your area and has experience with a whole house generator.

I have SMUD for electricity - very reliable and cheap. We have a well pump. No power = no water. Electricity was out for a day during the floods a couple of years ago. First time in 12-13 years the power was out for more than an hour.

After that, I had a plug installed so I can run a generator (propane powered). We have a large propane tank for our hot water heater and stove so with the generator running, we can shower, have drinking water and fill up containers. It’s a good set up for my needs. I have a lot of 25 and 30lb propane tanks. I have two large and one small generator. All champion brand. No problems with any of them. They all run on propane.

Friend lives outside of Reno in an off grid house. He was mainly doing solar and batteries with a gasoline powered generator back up. He got a diesel generator and large diesel tank recently installed because he was tired of filling up gas containers, making sure he had fresh gas, filling up his generator, etc.

Honda’s are nice. Quiet and reliable. However, they are expensive. I’ve heard good things about Champion home standby generators.

if you can put your own propane tank on your property, you don’t have to store and rotate gasoline cans or worry about having a flammable liquid around. Also don’t need to worry about natural gas being shut off due to an earthquake.

Good luck and please update the thread with pics.

 

[NATEWA]

Picture of my “generator plug.” I keep the generator, plug/cord and propane tank in a plastic shed next to the circuit breaker panel.

It’s not automatic so I would need to get out there and set it up. Again, my power has only been out for more than an hour once in 14 years so I don’t need an automatic generator.

 

[NATEWA]

Dennis-
Here are some of my thoughts after living with generators for a number of years in a less than stable power area .
I would recommend a whole house ( not just some of the circuits) if it's in the budget.
If you have any 220v loads , A/C, laundry dryer , heat, cooking etc, you will need more than a basic system. The smaller systems tend to be 110 V, single phase.
How dependable is the power in your area? How long of power outage do you want to prepare for?
If you anticipate running the generator days on end, you probably want a water cooled unit.
If it is just to cover the occasional outage , air cooled is probably fine.
Do you have Natural Gas or Propane?
If propane, you might think about getting a dedicated tank just for your gen.
That way you will always be prepared and if you do have an extended outage and can't get your tank refilled , you still might have propane for heat and cooking in the other tank. Ran into that living on the mountain for for a few years.
My experience is to go one size bigger than you think you need.
DT

Good advice from someone with experience.

 

[CDONA]

Nobody mentioned anything about car charging, too.

My rig has solar, 400 amp hours of lithium, and a 2 K inverter, with a button push.
None of this will power the AC, so I have a Honda 2200 that will, needs setup.