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STREET LEGAL REFLECTOR/LICENSE PLATE LIGHT

... therefore rim tape should qualify.

DOT does state that tape is ok for the sides (not that you have to have side reflectors in California.)

S5.1.1.4 Reflective material conforming to Federal Specification L-
S-300, Sheeting and Tape, Reflective; Non-exposed Lens, Adhesive
Backing
, September 7, 1965, may be used for side reflex reflectors if
this material as used on the vehicle, meets the performance standards in
either Table I or Table IA of SAE Standard J594f, Reflex Reflectors,
January 1977.


http://fmvss108.tripod.com/fmvss108text.htm
 
The "po-po" can also be said to enforce "some interpretation" of federal immigration laws, federal tax laws, and federal labor standards laws too. Your statement is vague and lacks foundation. My point has already been confirmed by your own citations of:

S5.8.10 Unless otherwise specified in this standard, each lamp,
reflective device, or item of associated equipment to which paragraph
S5.8.1 applies may be labeled with the symbol DOT, which shall
constitute a certification that it conforms to applicable Federal motor
vehicle safety standards.

Perhaps "interpretation" was a poor choice of verbage.

Yes, I said I was wrong regarding the markings of DOT/SAE approved lighting... the federal standards do not require the markings, though some states still may.
FMVSS - DOT is not an enforceable standard by anyone other than Federal or State appointed safety inspectors, and the courts. We do not have mandatory safety inspections here in California, only SMOG. It might be possible for the cops to send you to one of those inspectors, its called a fix-it ticket.

Each state either follows the FMVSS code or has their own modified version of it, based off of the FMVSS codes. So, yes, you can say that the FMVSS standards are not enforceable by police officers, because it is a federal standard. However, the state standards, which are the same as, or are based upon, the FMVSS standards are certainly enforceable by law enforcement officers... even if only to a certain degree.

It doesn't take a doctorate in engineering to determine that a set of brake lights that are 10" off the ground are illegal or that there are no reflectors on the back of your bike or you don't have any license plate illumination... direct violations of said vehicle code (Federal and California), black and white.

Where your circumvention of the law methods may work are in the details of the codes... like a replacement taillight that is not DOT approved (also violating state code)... it still functions the same as the original, approved part, but does not meet the photometric standards for an approved replacement unit. There would be no way for a police officer to determine photometric performance of that light, so you may get away with it as it is a bit gray. The same would apply to a license plate light if there was one, but maybe not bright enough. As you said, you may end up with a fix-it ticket in these hypothetical situations, which would most likely result in requiring remedying the offending item(s).

So, I would say the vehicle safety standards are enforceable by an officer of the law, though, not all of the details of the standards, especially where a testing/performance requirement is involved.
 
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DOT does state that tape is ok for the sides (not that you have to have side reflectors in California.)

S5.1.1.4 Reflective material conforming to Federal Specification L-
S-300, Sheeting and Tape, Reflective; Non-exposed Lens, Adhesive
Backing
, September 7, 1965, may be used for side reflex reflectors if
this material as used on the vehicle, meets the performance standards in
either Table I or Table IA of SAE Standard J594f, Reflex Reflectors,
January 1977.


http://fmvss108.tripod.com/fmvss108text.htm


Quoting a speck of usefulness in a sea of asshatery.
 
i think they mean they have to have 8 inches of separation from each signal and not be integrated into the brake light. my rear stock lights on my bikes, which i know for a fact are dot and street legal were only about 8 inches apart from where the base of the lens starts on each one, and the lens were only about 2 inches in width. i just saw a new 10rr that had even less distance between the lens, but was as well dot legal and stock. your modern cal license plate material is reflective and does meet the definition of a reflector, like reflective tape. (cal used to have non reflective flat black and orange plates).
i no longer have a plate light on one of them, i was rear ended and it was broken and i never bothered to replace it as my plate is in the correct position and full readable with any small amount of external light, even moon light, so it has never been a problem, and my running rear tail light does illuminate the plate a little because of the slight angle of it and that the plate is behind it.

but here is something you should keep in mind. you do not have to have or use your turn signals and can use hand signals instead, so a turn signal equipment violation is only valid if it is witnessed you actually using them instead of hand signals while riding the moto, not when it is parked.
 
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me 2, you 0

best of 5?

I'm not sure what's more entertaining here... your editing of your posts, the twisting of my words to your liking, or your just hearing what you want to.


I'd love to continue the debate, but I have more non-DOT compliant parts to design and I'm not getting shit done spending time on BARF.
 
I'm not sure what's more entertaining here... your editing of your posts, the twisting of my words to your liking, or your just hearing what you want to.

let me know when you decide, so that I can rebutt and argue with you about that too.

i said butt. :laughing
 
that was some good reading there. Specially the two going at it about fookin lights and reflectors...better things in the work to so worked up over. But thanks for the good read none the less.
 
You know, with all this time discussing what is and isnt legal.... most folks could have made there own that meets your needs/wants AND meets the legal requirements.

Visible plate (not behind your tire) - check
Plate illumination - check
Minimum blinker spacing - check

Complaining about getting pulled over for not having minimum requirements, loud pipes etc..... silly :twofinger
 

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Ok, I haven't seen this mentioned. How 'bout additional, but white reflective material facing the rear? Say I have my stock fender with it's reflector and I feel I want more reflectivity to the rear. Can I put white reflective vinyl on say, the back ends of the swingarm, for example?
 
Ok, I haven't seen this mentioned. How 'bout additional, but white reflective material facing the rear? Say I have my stock fender with it's reflector and I feel I want more reflectivity to the rear. Can I put white reflective vinyl on say, the back ends of the swingarm, for example?

yes you can
 
what is interesting about that is the law that requires that predates the use of the modern reflective paints now found on license plates. your entire license plate is a reflector and any light shone upon it will reflectively over power the little 5 watt bulb. california plates used to be flat black with non reflective orange letters. so you could argue that you do have a reflector on the plate, built in to it, but the light is still required and you can get a mini led light which does little but will meet that legal requirement.

turn signals are not required at all, you can either not have them or have tiny ones and use hand signals as well or instead. only one mirror is also required on a moto. you do not have to use turn signals on a moto, you can use hand signals instead and it is fully legal, and thus, you cannot be pulled over for your signals being inadequate unless you are turning and using them with out hand signals. i use both hand signals and my dot aftermarket turn signals during the day, because even the oem ones were just as hard to see, and at night i use just the turn signals because they are more than bright enough at night.

Barf, I got pulled over for just using hand signals thread!
 
So, can I put a reflector on the back of my helmet? Like one of those tape type? Or maybe the reflective panels on my jacket?

I am in the midst right now of trying to track down some LED License bolts for my bike.. hard to find... pain the arse..

any kragens or other type of auto store has led plate lights, usually for about 5 bucks. I found the exact ones that cycle gear sells for 29.00 at kragens for 6:wtf
 
Those dime sized reflectors will get you a ticket too. but, i'm sure only if you're getting out of the original speeding ticket.

The cvc said something about nothing physically blocking the license plate.
 
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