• There has been a recent cluster of spammers accessing BARFer accounts and posting spam. To safeguard your account, please consider changing your password. It would be even better to take the additional step of enabling 2 Factor Authentication (2FA) on your BARF account. Read more here.

Let's hope this thread is short on Bay Area Fire Season

byke said:
I have a question somewhat based on other Mike's post that you may have some insight on. Do you know how prescribed burns are scheduled? I'm reading stuff that has me wondering if reality is closer to other Mike's post, but I don't know. I remember seeing them pretty frequently around the levee's as a kid because they were near the local dirt riding spot, but not as much in later years. From how far up the chain of leadership, are prescribed burns decided?
Click to expand...
I am not sure.
 
byke said:
I have a question somewhat based on other Mike's post that you may have some insight on. Do you know how prescribed burns are scheduled? I'm reading stuff that has me wondering if reality is closer to other Mike's post, but I don't know. I remember seeing them pretty frequently around the levee's as a kid because they were near the local dirt riding spot, but not as much in later years. From how far up the chain of leadership, are prescribed burns decided?
Click to expand...
in our county, PRCD (placer resource conservation district) schedules them on public land based on the fire risk map. they also reach out to private land owners to encourage them to burn (also based on the risk map). reactively, they take requests and applications from private land owners they haven’t proactively contacted. they also keep an equipment inventory that qualified burn bosses can use for their projects, and have a team of trained volunteers that can be used for crew.
 
Brokenlink said:
Jesus Christ dude. You would complain if they didn't send resources and complain when they do.
Click to expand...
My mistake, they're such a benevolent, decent and thoughtful company that they're doing this out of the goodness of their hearts!
 
A video surfaced showing the Eaton fire starting at a power station / tower but the power people say it was shut down for the winds. I would assume that would be an easy check.

Kids are back in school for areas not in evacuation zones. That is good.
 
Air quality sites are showing that air quality is about as good as it gets in LA, currently.
 
Climber said:
My mistake, they're such a benevolent, decent and thoughtful company that they're doing this out of the goodness of their hearts!
Click to expand...
have said this before - after our big fire (evac’d for 11 days), PG&E sent in a long convoy of heavy equipment crews immediately after the all clear. people lined our road cheering them when they came rolling in.
 
littlebeast said:
in our county, PRCD (placer resource conservation district) schedules them on public land based on the fire risk map. they also reach out to private land owners to encourage them to burn (also based on the risk map). reactively, they take requests and applications from private land owners they haven’t proactively contacted. they also keep an equipment inventory that qualified burn bosses can use for their projects, and have a team of trained volunteers that can be used for crew.
Click to expand...
What makes them actually happen?

Also, we lived in a very high fire zone for 11 years in Placer County and just moved over summer. When you mention encouraging landowners, are you talking about getting the little defensible space pamphlet in the mail?
 
littlebeast said:
have said this before - after our big fire (evac’d for 11 days), PG&E sent in a long convoy of heavy equipment crews immediately after the all clear. people lined our road cheering them when they came rolling in.
Click to expand...
You've seen how much rates have gone up all across the state in just the last year?

Yeah, you were glad to see them, and on that day they were perceived as hero's, and I have a lot of respect for the people who actually do the work, but the Execs are not those people.
 
byke said:
What makes them actually happen?

Also, we lived in a very high fire zone for 11 years in Placer County and just moved over summer. When you mention encouraging landowners, are you talking about getting the little defensible space pamphlet in the mail?
Click to expand...
wrt private land owners, no this is unrelated to defensible space communication - it’s specifically related to prescribed burns. RCD schedules, organizes the equipment & staffing, supervises them, and puts out public notices (you will see smoke in this area on this date). the fire risk map is maintained by placer OES, and RCD contacts private land owners directly. they also do outreach through the local fire safe councils and other community meetings. the fire safe councils are a great resource - a lot of resident-to-resident persuasion happens through the personal connections the people in those organizations have.
 
Climber said:
You've seen how much rates have gone up all across the state in just the last year?

Yeah, you were glad to see them, and on that day they were perceived as hero's, and I have a lot of respect for the people who actually do the work, but the Execs are not those people.
Click to expand...
irrespective of the execs, those crews aren’t ‘perceived’ heroes, they work their asses off. real heroes. huge respect.
 
One thing that's common in Fresno is the stucco walls and concrete roof tiles, I can't help but think that the houses here are probably less likely to catch fire in the event of burning embers blowing around.

However, that wouldn't apply to all of the ponderosa trees that somebody thought was a good idea to plant all over the place.
 
littlebeast said:
wrt private land owners, no this is unrelated to defensible space communication - it’s specifically related to prescribed burns. RCD schedules, organizes the equipment & staffing, supervises them, and puts out public notices (you will see smoke in this area on this date). the fire risk map is maintained by placer OES, and RCD contacts private land owners directly. they also do outreach through the local fire safe councils and other community meetings. the fire safe councils are a great resource - a lot of resident-to-resident persuasion happens through the personal connections the people in those organizations have.
Click to expand...
Ah, okay. We never had any of that, but I also realize the scale of these projects is bonkers when Placer County is bigger than the state of Rhode Island, with waaaay more difficult terrain.
 
Climber said:
One thing that's common in Fresno is the stucco walls and concrete roof tiles, I can't help but think that the houses here are probably less likely to catch fire in the event of burning embers blowing around.

However, that wouldn't apply to all of the ponderosa trees that somebody thought was a good idea to plant all over the place.
Click to expand...
concrete roof tiles are great. biggest risk to even a fire hardened structure is ladder fuels below windows and eves. the defensible space guidelines were recently updated to clear vegetation 5’ from the structure. that vegetation burns and fire can enter the structure through windows and get under the roof through the eves.
byke said:
Ah, okay. We never had any of that, but I also realize the scale of these projects is bonkers when Placer County is bigger than the state of Rhode Island, with waaaay more difficult terrain.
Click to expand...
yeah YMMV based on specifically where you’re located. OES manages it all through the fire risk map (a large number of agencies and experts provide input to that). it’s not just for structure protection, it’s also used to predict likely ignition sources, the resulting fire behavior and create spaces that will slow or stop forward progress. they also use it to identify ingress and egress maintenance requirements for evacuees and emergency vehicle access.

doesn’t always work, but not for lack of effort.
 
In our rural area, nobody is being encouraged to do burns, as the lots are small and most are not forested. Our place is a bit unique there, with forest comprised of white fir, lodgepole pine, willows and aspen. Over the years, we have thinned out the forest; I have personally removed about 100 trees and continue to remove ladder fuel in an expanding radius from the house. The community has chipping days, where they grind up anything 6" diameter or less. Some material is hauled away, while other people want it spread on the dirt roads to keep dust down. The chips are fuel, but they don't have much air. It's the next best thing to burning. Given enough time and traffic, the stuff breaks down and mixes with the soil.

The area is surrounded by national forest. Much of it is extremely dense and would make for a god awful fire. Crews have staged burn piles, some of which have been burned, others that have stood for years, waiting for the right conditions. While they are fuel, at least they are consolidated. This takes care of a lot of deadfall, but there are considerable ladder fuels and it's too much to expect that anyone is going to remove that in an area that remote.

Insurance companies would be happiest if the forest were clear cut. Of course, part of what makes these places desirable is the relative wildness of them.
 
Last edited:
littlebeast said:
irrespective of the execs, those crews aren’t ‘perceived’ heroes, they work their asses off. real heroes. huge respect.
Click to expand...
Thank you. We do work out asses off. All of us do. And then people with attitudes as seen here make it seem as if it's all a wasted effort. Some dude builds a development in a bad area and fails to maintain their land. Pg&es fault of course.

Clearly we are here to rip everyone off. It's in our business plan. Greeding with gloves is our motto.
 
According to PG&E's CEO, no wildfires were started this year by their infrastructure. It's a big step in the right direction, but the public memory is long (for some things, anyway). Hang in there, Mike.
 
So since I deal with the environmental permitting aspect of this all, I can say that the sheer cost and time constraints of doing vegetation management is massive. We have hazard and dead trees that were identified over two years ago that we can't work because we are still going through the permitting process (and we are mostly exempt from CEQA). You want a coastal development permit to cut that one tree? It's a 10k permit fee. Then add on the bio and cultural studies, the cost of my work, the cost of surveying the trees, and cost of cutting them. You've probably spent 30k on that one tree. Want to do one on the adjacent property? Start over.

By the way, this will take a year or more, involve the federal and state governments, and require a public meeting.

Got a problem with your electric bill? Complain about the coastal act and ask why this work is not streamlined or exempted.
 
I personally think that the forest fire fighters are among the hardest working people in this country.
That is extremely hard work that they're doing, very dangerous, they don't get as much sleep that they'd like and are probably not pulling down nearly as much as the work should pay.
Total respect for the people that do this!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top