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Digital SLR / DSLR Camera Question / DSLR Thread 2

equivalent zoom?

Can anyone tell me how to calculate the equivalent zoom for a DSLR lens?

Take for example a 70 - 300 mm zoom on a canon T2i which, according to Canon's website, has a "35mm-equivalent focal length (that) is approx. 1.6x the lens focal length". Does this mean it's equivalent to 3.2x to 13.7x when used on the T2i?

thanks
 
Not quite. Take the zoom range in mm, and multiply by the "crop factor" (1.6 for most Canon bodies)

The 70-300 works out to the equivalent of a 112-480mm lens.
 
Not quite. Take the zoom range in mm, and multiply by the "crop factor" (1.6 for most Canon bodies)

The 70-300 works out to the equivalent of a 112-480mm lens.

Thanks cycle61, now if I divide 112/50 and 480/50 I get 2.2x - 9.6x. Does that seem reasonable? I'm looking for a frame of reference to compare the focal length in mm to the X times zoom I'm used to seeing for point and shoot cameras.

I found the website below as i was searching for an answer and assume it means that a 50mm lens would be the equivalent of 1.0x (before accounting for the 1.6 factor)?

The zoom range should be listed in the camera's specifications, usually in a format similar to "35mm film equivalent: 28mm-280mm.” In most cases, a 50mm lens measurement is considered as "normal," with no magnification and no wide-angle capability.

Another website I found seems to use 35 mm as 1.0x

All zoom ratios have their focal length equivalents. Many times when you are reading about a compact camera, they will give both types of measurements. For example at 2x zoom has a focal length equivalent of 35mm to 70mm and a 4x zoom has a focal length equivalent of 35mm to 140mm.
 
Thanks cycle61, now if I divide 112/50 and 480/50 I get 2.2x - 9.6x. Does that seem reasonable? I'm looking for a frame of reference to compare the focal length in mm to the X times zoom I'm used to seeing for point and shoot cameras.

I found the website below as i was searching for an answer and assume it means that a 50mm lens would be the equivalent of 1.0x (before accounting for the 1.6 factor)?



Another website I found seems to use 35 mm as 1.0x

Because SLR's have historically been based on 35mm film, they still use that as the basis for magnification - further, 50mm is '1:1' with the human eye - note that if you look through the viewfinder with a 50mm lens, your field of view is neither expanded, nor compressed - whether you are looking through the viewfinder of a regular DSLR (20mm) or full frame (~35mm). But you simply see the same image - cropped - on the 20mm sensor-camera.

So, both are correct, ish... the 35mm is a 1x magnification when used on a crop body.

However, the 35mm is a wider field-of-view than the human eye, so purists would still say it's a 0.66 magnification - it's cramming more in than the neutral focal length of the 50mm lens, but it's 'magnified' because it is cropped onto a smaller sensor.

It's a bit misleading really - you're not really getting 1:1 representation from the 35mm - you're looking at a larger part of the world, then cropping it.

IMO, cropping =! magnification, so the second site you listed is a bit misleading, but I can see how for the layman, it's easier to understand.

Basically, instead of thinking 'how much can I fit on the sensor' you should be worried about, 'what is this doing to the depth-distortion?'.

Because you can always crop-to-zoom in post - most digital cameras have more than enough pixels to at least double your 'zoom' by cropping - especially if your destination is the screen, not print.
 
Because you can always crop-to-zoom in post - most digital cameras have more than enough pixels to at least double your 'zoom' by cropping - especially if your destination is the screen, not print.

thanks cycle61 and Joebar4000 for your responses - I've been messing around with crop to zoom and it's pretty nice for on screen viewing. First photo is the original reduced in size and second is cropped.
 

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I think the subject of image magnification due to crop sensor vs. full frame is one of the most misleading and confusing notions in terms of modern cameras.

Almost every book/site/ref will state that if you are using a cropped sensor you get an extra magnification out of a particular lens, but this really is just "built in" cropping that will affect your printed image. A cropped sensor is not actually getting extra Reach from a lens. Say, if i'm doing sports photography and im situated far from the subject, and i want to zoom into it using a 200mm focal length, this will equal 200mm optical focal length no matter which sensor size you use. Its is once you print the image into a standard size, that one can say your subject got magnified by the crop factor, just as with the example of the above bird.

For this reason, when i look at a lens' focal length for zooming in, i dont think of the equivalent zoom, but the actual reach. It is in the wide angles that a crop sensor forces me to add the crop factor, because it will indeed make my field of view narrower.
 
An easier analog for a 50mm on an SLR body is this:

Get a piece of paper. Cut a rectangle in it.

Looking through the hole in the paper, the view is neither expanded nor compressed.

A smaller sensor is simply like having a smaller rectangle cut in the paper.

That's it.

It is based on a pinhole being 50mm from a 35mm frame size.

When the frame size is 20mm, you just get less of the picture.

But on a point and shoot, for example, the sensor is smaller - and so is the focal length. Which is why you get silly things like 9mm focal lengths on a tiny camera, but it's still only the equivalent of a 35mm lens on an SLR.

If you move the pinhole closer to the sensor - as in a P&S, then the focal length will be shorter for a given field-of-view. I.e. to see the same amount of world in a smaller camera, the focal length HAS to be shorter because the 'pinhole' is closer to the plane of the sensor.


In this diagram, S2 is the focal length. Clearly, for a large camera, like an SLR, this distance can be larger. At 50mm it is 'neutral' - it's like there is a pinhole at 50mm away from the sensor, that neither condenses nor expands light.

Now, imagine that you shrink that distance to 35mm, but all else stays the same. To fill the sensor, the lens must 'see' more the the world and be a wider angle.

But if you have a P&S with a 10mm sensor, now a 35 mm focal length is actually a zoom lens!

It's confusing because when they launched DSLR's, they did not make the lenses 'fit' onto the smaller sensor size - they just crop unwanted light. Hence, crop-sensor, not simply, 'small sensor'.

535px-Lens_angle_of_view.svg.png
 
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To add further confusion, when camera companies list a camera as having a "12x Zoom!" they aren't talking about a lens that has the magnification abilities of 12 times that of the human eye, they're expressing a ratio of the widest focal length to the most telephoto focal length. So a 10x zoom could be a 5-50mm zoom lens, or a 20mm-200mm, or a 40mm-400mm.

Applying this to popular DSLr lenses, the popular 18mm=200mm lenses are ~10x zooms, the venerable 70-200mm lenses are 2.9x zooms, and the legendary 600mm f/5.6 L is a mere 1x zoom.

More meaningless numbers, in short. :teeth
 
exactly! Always trying to figure out why engineers have to come up with such odd ways of expressing things that should be more easily understood!
 
so my friend said she wants to get into photography and wants help looking for the right camera. im really only familiar with nikon since thats what i own but what would you guys recommend with a budget of about 600?
 
Just got my Nikon D3100 in yesterday. I love that thing, super light and easy to use. :)
 
Just got home from Yosemite. Shot 99% of my photos on some B&W film. Brought my DSLR though for the Firefalls shot. Took this one a few hours ago

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Apparently its been reallllly hard to get this shot this year. This is only the 2nd day the Firefalls appeared at all, and it's doubtful it'll show again till next year.

Here's a shot I got while setting up, huge chunk of snow falling off

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How it was on Saturday (and I suspect how it was the past few weeks)

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Also, I randomly met Ken Rockwell around the lodge :laughing
 
haha ive got no problem with ken. he has generally pretty unbiased gear reviews. just skip over any opinions he has about anything else
 
:laughing

Also, getting set up for my kids' tournament tomorrow. Have a 10-24 and a sigma 50-150 2.8 rented, that should cover group shots in tight spaces and some detail/closeup action stuff as well.

Indoor shooting with the D200...*ugh*
 
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