Helmet expiration dates

[Gabe]

I do see your point Gabe, and I accept it. Any helmet is better than no helmet. It can't possibly hurt. (well, the Shoei chin bar broke my collar bone on a dirt bike get off years ago, a magnificent high side that landed me at Kaiser) but still... no head injury.

My thinking is the things we do to stay safe on a motorcycle is additive. Nothing we can do will get us to 100% or maybe even to 50% "safe." But each rider course we take, the gear we choose, the helmet and how it fits, and of course, the "in the moment" riding choices we make, add to or detract from the "safety" side. The goal is to put as many things in the plus side as we can isn't it?

And I appreciate your work and reporting on helmets, gear, what works and what doesn't. Lot's of mis-information out there and your reputation is good.

Yay! Thanks man. Well said.

 

[Hank Wong]

I second that. Yeh! Thank you Gabe.

 

[Killroy1999]

Have the helmet companies ever showed any test data that justifies the so called expiration date?

 

[Shaggy]

Have the helmet companies ever showed any test data that justifies the so called expiration date?

It’s probably more of a liability issue for the manufacturer than anything else.

Also.... think of it like the expiration date on a pack of ramen noodles. Is it still good after 2 weeks expired? 6 months? 2 years? 10 years? 50 years? The real question is “How hungry are you?”

An interesting test would be to compare the impact data of 10yo top o’ the line helmet with a brand new economy brand helmet.

 

[rama]

There is one relatively new advancement in helmet technology. My bicycling helmet is a MIPS, which is a system that helps reduce rotational force to the brain: https://mipsprotection.com/

They dominate most modern bicycle crash testing results, for instance:
https://www.helmet.beam.vt.edu/bicycle-helmet-ratings.html

It looks like Bell introduced some motorcycle helmets with this type of liner:
https://www.bellhelmets.com/technology/mips.html

I don't know how well MIPS performs at motorcycle speeds, but I won't buy a bicycling helmet without it.

 

[Gabe]

There is one relatively new advancement in helmet technology. My bicycling helmet is a MIPS, which is a system that helps reduce rotational force to the brain: https://mipsprotection.com/

They dominate most modern bicycle crash testing results, for instance:
https://www.helmet.beam.vt.edu/bicycle-helmet-ratings.html

It looks like Bell introduced some motorcycle helmets with this type of liner:
https://www.bellhelmets.com/technology/mips.html

I don't know how well MIPS performs at motorcycle speeds, but I won't buy a bicycling helmet without it.

Huh. Well, what the hell do the Swedes know about safety, anyway

I do wonder what the difference is in real-world fatality/injury data. I also feel the same way about airbag vests (and yes I've heard anecdotes about the benefits of wearing one).

 

[matty]

An interesting test would be to compare the impact data of 10yo top o’ the line helmet with a brand new economy brand helmet.

I suspect it wouldn't too different, if different at all. All helmet manufacturers use the same key ingredient in their recipes: EPS. And it seems that stuff just doesn't degrade. Heck, how long does it take for a Styrofoam cup to degrade, 500 years or more?

There is one relatively new advancement in helmet technology. ..

I don't know how well MIPS performs at motorcycle speeds, but I won't buy a bicycling helmet without it.

My Bell MX-9 adv has Mips, but I haven't made any plans to test it

 

[Blankpage]

Have the helmet companies ever showed any test data that justifies the so called expiration date?

Unless parts start falling off first my nose tells me when my helmet has reached the end of its life, not the date on a tag.

 

[Surj]

Didn't City Bike cry) do an article on this at some point? I remember donating some old helmets.

We did, and thanks again for donating test helmets! The story, “The Truth about Helmets,” is here on the rotting remains of the CityBike website which I am still keeping live for some reason. Inertia, I guess.

Short version: most, but not all, of the helmets I gathered for testing passed to their original standards. This isn’t by any means real science: these two paragraphs sum it up pretty well, I think:

“Throughout the day, we’re surprised at the low number of failures we’re seeing. A couple particularly ancient lids pass all tests, no problem. Here’s the thing though—remember that we’re testing our helmets against the standards they were originally certified to, not current standards. Also, just because a ten year old helmet passes, that doesn’t mean that it wouldn’t have done a better job of protecting your noggin when it was just a couple years old.

We don’t have any definitive background info on most of the helmets that failed, but here’s an interesting tidbit: 115, the 1993 helmet that failed 4 out of 6 tests, was an old stock, brand new helmet that had been hanging around a showroom for 20 years. It seems clear that environmental factors wreaked havoc on this one. Also, it’s worth noting that most of the failed helmets were “premium” brands.“

There’s a table with results that folks can review for more detail. I should emphasize again that the sample set is way too small for real conclusions. But of the helmets that got the full range of testing (we collected a lot more but were limited in what we could test), nearly 25% of them failed.

Having done this testing and corresponding research firsthand, my own opinion is that a well-cared for helmet is probably safe past the five-year limit, but it’s hard to know, and periodically replacing your helmet is a good thing despite the flat earther-esque “Wake up, sheep! Helmet companies only care about profits!” claims from the “I googled it” contingent. The reality is that helmets get funky and beat-up if worn regularly, and mine mostly get replaced by that point anyway so it’s moot.

Yes, that was my last issue I edited. We had Bell in Scots Valley test 20-30 helmets. They all performed like new ones.

Bullshit, sir. While it’s true that I started the legwork on the story while you were still half-assing it (or less) along with CityBike, you didn’t do any work on this story. I collected the helmets, did the testing with the team at Bell, and published the story several issues after you’d stopped fulfilling your commitments.

If you’d actually edited the story you’d know that “they all performed like new ones” is not true (as noted above). But by all means, go on claiming to be an authority here.

 

[Map8]

Thanks Surj.

 

[Gabe]

Bullshit, sir. While it’s true that I started the legwork on the story while you were still half-assing it (or less) along with CityBike, you didn’t do any work on this story. I collected the helmets, did the testing with the team at Bell, and published the story several issues after you’d stopped fulfilling your commitments.

If you’d actually edited the story you’d know that “they all performed like new ones” is not true (as noted above). But by all means, go on claiming to be an authority here.

This was 6 years ago.

And now everyone knows what a petty little bitch you are. Good job.

 

[Hank Wong]

Surj and Gabe,
Of all the motorcycle publications, City Bike is the one I like the most and I miss the most. No need to split hair. You guys are the best in the motorcycle publication world, knowledgeable, unbiased, down-to-earth and in a we-all-ride style of reporting.
Thank you both.

 

[Surj]

This was 6 years ago.

And now everyone knows what a petty little bitch you are. Good job.

Ahh. So, when elsewhere in this very thread, you said this:

..new riders look to us for advice, so please fact-check what you post.

you were advocating for fact-checking by others, but not for so-called professional moto-journalists like you who ought to know better? Never mind that you are also falsely claiming credit for the work you’re misquoting.

But yeah, that makes me a “petty little bitch.”

Surj and Gabe,
Of all the motorcycle publications, City Bike is the one I like the most and I miss the most. No need to split hair. You guys are the best in the motorcycle publication world, knowledgeable, unbiased, down-to-earth and in a we-all-ride style of reporting.
Thank you both.

Thanks.

I don’t think it’s splitting hairs to point out that Gabe’s statement that all helmets “performed like new ones” is substantially inaccurate and very relevant to the conversation.

 

[matty]

....(the) helmet that failed 4 out of 6 tests, was an old stock, brand new helmet that had been hanging around a showroom for 20 years. It seems clear that environmental factors wreaked havoc on this one. Also, it’s worth noting that most of the failed helmets were “premium” brands.“[/I]

There goes my 500 year old styrofoam cup analogy

And I'm about to invoke the irreverence of Brian Halton in a minute, if y'all keep it up. Seriously, CB was the best moto rag out there, under all 3 editors, despite how you feel about each other.

 

[JakesKTM]

I bought two sets of pads for my RF1100 - on my second set now. It feels just like new. The fiberglass shell is in great shape. I see another 5 years of life left unless it is impacted.

Save $100 per year for the next helmet.

 

[afm199]

Surj and Gabe, sorry to see you guys pissing on each other. You both brought lots of value to the moto world with City Bike.

 

[BillSmith]

Good info for BARFers and the hair yanking with earring pulling adds to an entertaining thread.

 

[DucatiHoney]

You're being suspended for name-calling, violation of TOS 4.1

This was 6 years ago.

And now everyone knows what a petty little bitch you are. Good job.

It could be said that this personal row between the two of you is taking away attention from some great information. Burying the hatchet might be a great new year's resolution.

 

[afm199]

You're being suspended for name-calling, violation of TOS 4.1



It could be said that this personal row between the two of you is taking away attention from some great information. Burying the hatchet might be a great new year's resolution.

So Gabe gets suspended for an insult but Surj can say: "Bullshit, sir. While it’s true that I started the legwork on the story while you were still half-assing it (or less) along with CityBike." ?

 

[kuksul08]

So Gabe gets suspended for an insult but Surj can say: "Bullshit, sir. While it’s true that I started the legwork on the story while you were still half-assing it (or less) along with CityBike." ?

One is name calling and the other is using profanity as flair