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Questions for Keith Code - Round Two

I'd just add to Keith's post to make sure that once you have the lever in the right spot, you should tighten down the lock nuts to make sure the lever doesn't move any more or come loose afterwards. I've had it happen and it's not fun. :laughing
 
Z3n said:
I'd just add to Keith's post to make sure that once you have the lever in the right spot, you should tighten down the lock nuts to make sure the lever doesn't move any more or come loose afterwards. I've had it happen and it's not fun. :laughing
Click to expand...

:thumbup Guess that's why I don't write repair manuals!

Keith
 
Keith,
Do you recommend always using the front brake to set entry sped into a turn as a habit, and to never rely just on engine braking? I think one of the books I read (probably hough's) made this recommendation, and so I used to do that. But when I was touring in Europe with some racer friends of mine (much better riders than me), they suggested using engine braking if I could as that would make me smoother. So I've been doing that preferentially. Your comment below makes me question this now?

Thx much. Incidentally, I think it is excellent that you do this, and I'm saving up to come back to CSS (loved level 1 at sears point back in October). :ride

Oh yes, one more thing. You shouldn't rely on the engine braking to slow you down for corners, you should rely on the front brake to do that job. So even if you were in 3rd for a 1st gear corner you still have more control over the slowing down process with the front brake than you can ever have with the engine.

Beside that, you shouldn't be riding that fast on the street for this to be a problem! Get to one of the local track day providers or come to school for that.

Keith
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RRrider said:
Keith,
Do you recommend always using the front brake to set entry sped into a turn as a habit, and to never rely just on engine braking? I think one of the books I read (probably hough's) made this recommendation, and so I used to do that. But when I was touring in Europe with some racer friends of mine (much better riders than me), they suggested using engine braking if I could as that would make me smoother. So I've been doing that preferentially. Your comment below makes me question this now?

Thx much. Incidentally, I think it is excellent that you do this, and I'm saving up to come back to CSS (loved level 1 at sears point back in October). :ride
Click to expand...

Those are two different scenarios. If you are riding with the intention to not use the brakes, that is fine and there are a number of benefits to that style of street riding, not least of which is that you are more sensitive to turn entry speeds.

I was referring to a more aggressive approach to cornering where you needed to use the brake.

Yes, front brake only. Not because of it but just as an example, you will note that very few MotoGP riders use the rear, especially obvious if they are hanging their right leg off the bike on turn entry. On the other hand Casey Stoner uses it to control power output on his bike.

As far as front brake versus engine, as I said before, you have much more control over your rate of deceleration with the brake lever than with the engine backpressure. No matter how many gears you go down, it is not adjustable on the fly like the brake is.

Along with 36,000 others, you may already have read this braking article but here is the address if you haven't: http://forums.superbikeschool.com/index.php?showtopic=310

Keith
 
Keith...

This just makes me smile... "27 BMW S1000RRs --OMG" :thumbup
 
Same old f'd up knee.... Cannot get it bent far enough to reach the right peg without extreme pain... So the motard with the comfy leg position gets the nod.

Someday a knee replacement will get me back to the track. Keep thinking injury will force the issue, but I have been lucky... I guess :p
 
Keith Code said:
Danibee,

First thing to do is sit on the bike in your normal riding position and check the gear lever position. If it is too low you have to reach for it and under acceleration that alone can create the problem.

In this case loosen the adjuster lock nuts and rotate the the threaded tube to raise the lever. Just make the lock nuts finger tight. Get back on the bike and see if it is easier to pull the shift lever from that position. Keep on adjusting it till it is just right for you.

GP pattern is easier upshifting for most people and it shouldn't take you long to master it. If you flip the pivot arm to reverse the pattern you will still have to adjust the lever for perfect up/down positioning.

Oh yes, one more thing. You shouldn't rely on the engine braking to slow you down for corners, you should rely on the front brake to do that job. So even if you were in 3rd for a 1st gear corner you still have more control over the slowing down process with the front brake than you can ever have with the engine.

Beside that, you shouldn't be riding that fast on the street for this to be a problem! Get to one of the local track day providers or come to school for that.

Keith
Click to expand...

Thanks Keith! Great info without even seeing me ride. Also good tip on the braking. Since I am trying to improve my riding I should practice it the right way. :teeth And yes. A public road is not a closed track. Your awesome for all you do buddy!
Hopefully I will get out there with the ZoomZoom folks or the like so I can learn and apply in a safe environment. Good luck with the new video!
 
Hi Keith! Can I ask a quick question?

How to conquer the fear of lean in on a turn when there are some hazards out there (slippery road, blind corners, turn entry speed, etc)?
 
alpha84 said:
Hi Keith! Can I ask a quick question?

How to conquer the fear of lean in on a turn when there are some hazards out there (slippery road, blind corners, turn entry speed, etc)?
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alpha84,

There is no way to conquer the fear of the possibility of something being on the road's surface in a corner. You never know unless you pre-run the road or are the only one on a track. I hate to say it. but, that's part of the thrill of riding corners on the road, you don't know.

I'd need you to clarify your point though. Do you mean you are afraid to commit the bike to the turn or that you are timid when it comes to leaning it over pretty far?

Keith
 
not a question, just a statement...

I love your column/editorial in motorcyclist, after initially browsing all the pictures it's usually the first bit of words I actually read :) Thanks :)
 
Anybody here?

Hi,

I hope this thread is still alive... :rolleyes

Anyway, I have a question for Keith regarding training. I started racing supermoto last season and really enjoy it. While I do understand roadracing and supermoto are different (I have done both), some training elements are the same (quick flick, wide vision, RPs...).
Here is my question: In order of importance, what should a beginner like me start working on?
So far I am guessing:
1- Body position / movements on the bike
2- Wide vision / 2 step technique / RPs
3- Throttle control
4- Lean angle
5- Quick flick
6- Lines
7- Braking

Does that seem like the right order? I am thinking about tackling 2 or 3 per trackday.

Thanks.

PS: I read all the 35 pages, and it is a great addition to the books and the DVD on some points.
 
Keith please show the truth to all who think that they can get there bike to respond to putting weight on the pegs (your book explains it soo beautifully!! still people think differently... how, i have no clue!) my bikes have always repsonded to pushing on the bars but i still hear people swear that pushing on the pegs works! BTW... another question, HOW MUCH DO YOU LOVVE TO BMW's vs: the older 636 fleet you ran. Also last one, can I borrow the slide machine and take it to 9? lol CSBS is a great program to all that are interested!
 
Judaslefourbe said:
Hi,

I hope this thread is still alive... :rolleyes

Anyway, I have a question for Keith regarding training. I started racing supermoto last season and really enjoy it. While I do understand roadracing and supermoto are different (I have done both), some training elements are the same (quick flick, wide vision, RPs...).
Here is my question: In order of importance, what should a beginner like me start working on?
So far I am guessing:
1- Body position / movements on the bike
2- Wide vision / 2 step technique / RPs
3- Throttle control
4- Lean angle
5- Quick flick
6- Lines
7- Braking

Does that seem like the right order? I am thinking about tackling 2 or 3 per trackday.

Thanks.

PS: I read all the 35 pages, and it is a great addition to the books and the DVD on some points.
Click to expand...

It's good that you have an idea of what the technical points of riding are. That's a start. Picking body position first is off the mark.

Even though it is hip and stylish, focusing on body position doesn't give you better command of the other 6 and in many ways can actually slow your progress. It's like playing air guitar to a Jimi Hendricks tune :)

Work out what you are doing with your right wrist and follow the basic rules of throttle control. Even with sophisticated electronic traction control, the guys who are the quickest still have the best throttle control--by the book throttle control. (admittedly it is my book but what can I say, that's the way they do it too.

The reason it is difficult to self coach is that riders do what 'feels right' rather than what is right. So if you didn't start riding when you were 4, don't be impatient, spend enough time with each point, you have listed without jumping around from one to the other.

In the end, for most of us, coaching is the way to go. That extra set of trained eyes that see things you don't see is the single quickest way to improvement.

Keith
 
Wicked4Racin said:
Keith please show the truth to all who think that they can get there bike to respond to putting weight on the pegs (your book explains it soo beautifully!! still people think differently... how, i have no clue!) my bikes have always repsonded to pushing on the bars but i still hear people swear that pushing on the pegs works! BTW... another question, HOW MUCH DO YOU LOVVE TO BMW's vs: the older 636 fleet you ran. Also last one, can I borrow the slide machine and take it to 9? lol CSBS is a great program to all that are interested!
Click to expand...

To be honest, I've been through this so many times I thought it was a closed subject after so many years. OK, we'll cut to the chase.

Imagine mounting a hydraulic ram between the frame up by the tank and a foot peg. As you ride along you press the button and the ram extends putting pressure on the peg. What will happen?

The BMW's are incredible. Feel like a 600 with double the power but it's so manageable and forgiving. Crashes at the school were down 40% last year, that tells you something about the S1000RR.

Meanwhile, our new Slide Bide is an S1000 and wouldn't you know---it is really easy to spin the rear tire for the drills we do :party

Keith
 
Hi Keith, Dylan,

Thank you for the quick response!
I guess I will start on throttle control and lines then!

As far as self coaching goes, I understand why it is not ideal (you covered it earlier in the thread), but I do not have much options: I just had a baby (Eva, 5 month old now!:thumbup), so I do not have the time and money to go to the track as much as I should.

However I am still training on some of the items as I found a good and cheap to do so: my car.
Since I use it every day for commute I figured I could use that time to trying to limit my number of inputs during turns, find RPs, and roll on the gas. I even train my wide vision (I have a piece of tape on the steering wheel with "Wide Open" written on it to remind me). We'll see if it works. :rofl
 
Judaslefourbe said:
Hi Keith, Dylan,

Thank you for the quick response!
I guess I will start on throttle control and lines then!

As far as self coaching goes, I understand why it is not ideal (you covered it earlier in the thread), but I do not have much options: I just had a baby (Eva, 5 month old now!:thumbup), so I do not have the time and money to go to the track as much as I should.

However I am still training on some of the items as I found a good and cheap to do so: my car.
Since I use it every day for commute I figured I could use that time to trying to limit my number of inputs during turns, find RPs, and roll on the gas. I even train my wide vision (I have a piece of tape on the steering wheel with "Wide Open" written on it to remind me). We'll see if it works. :rofl
Click to expand...

Absolutely, I've been doing the same thing for 30 years. It may be better than playing MotoGP on X Box :)

If you ride a bicycle, which is a good thing on its own for the leg workout, practicing the visual techniques works out well there too.

Keith
 
Hi Keith,

I have another question (maybe stupid?):
Is the throttle control affected if the turn is going uphill/downhill?
I would suspect that the balance of the bike would change from 40/60, but I am not sure if it changes enough to impact the throttle control.

Thanks.
 
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