Rider Longevity

[Cookie Monster]

Cookie, another difference of opinion. I don't think I've ever used my horn to get a cars attention. In 43 years and 400,000+ miles. With the sheer number of dumb bastards driving their cars with the white Apple headphones in to the number of cars with 2000 watt stereos in them, you aren't going to be heard. I think I might have beeped to signal my buddy we were turning.

And I don't hover next to cars. I get past, immediately. Even if there is a lot of traffic , I'll clear past until I find a spot to stay in with no cars.

I will definitely take your word over mine considering I have about a year of riding and ~5000 miles under my belt, but a few days ago a car tried to merge into my lane and I gave a quick toot of the horn and he backed off and slowed down to merge behind me. I was on the brakes anyways so if he hadn't heard me I would have slowed down enough to let him by, though.

I will definitely keep what you said in mind, so I don't end up relying on the horn to keep me out of trouble.

 

[2strokeYardSale]

Respect the speed delta.

Watch others' speed deltas. The guy going 10 mph faster than anybody else is going to want to change lanes The guy going 10 mph slower than anybody else is going to cause everybody else to change lanes around him.

Freeway is safer than surface streets, generally.

The only thing more dangerous than intersections is the intersections you don't know of (unseen side streets) and the intersections spontaneously made up by idiot drivers (Crazy Ivan u-turns). Respect the delta.

Riding since 1987, not dead yet.

 

[ilikefood]

A lot of it has to do with luck.

Sure, to the same extent that not getting hit by a meteorite has to do with luck. Situations where a crash was completely random and couldn't be prevented by riding smarter in some way are very, very rare.

 

[domingo3]

Here's how fatal crashes have occurred over the past 10 years (nearly 700 deaths 2004-2013):

Going from that, and focusing on prevention of the top 3...

1. Learn how to get the bike through a curve. Not like Rossi, just competently. If you're thinking about bullshit like a stylish body position and how deep to trail-brake and what traction control setting to use, you're not thinking about fundamentals like entry speed, line, and throttle roll-on.
   
   
2. Learn how to identify crossing-vehicle threats and tactics for dealing with them. These are often discussed, and there are a few 1Rider threads dedicated to them.
   
   
3. Ride sober, and keep your head and eyes UP, so whatever happens, you can see it developing before it, er, impacts you.

Forget about "luck". That's a comfortable explanation to adopt because you're freed from making a judgment about another rider and from applying a hard lesson to your own riding. Sure, random shit happens. But if you presume a certain incident is unpreventable, it IS unpreventable by you. But if you presume there is an observation or expectation or tactic that will reduce its likelihood, you'll probably find one.

I gotta say thanks for sticking around, Data Dan.

 

[Z3n]

This is huge. Riding within your personal limits should pretty much erase #1, #3, #4, #6. That's about 60% of your risk of a fatal right there. Given the speed of most lane splitters and the stats on that, staying under 15mph delta at reasonable speeds should keep you out of that one. At that point you're just dodging the fatals of crossing vehicles, head ons, and pedestrians/uturns, and all of these things are also mitigated by slowing the fuck down. That 9% "other" is actually what I'd be curious about, but that's a minority of fatals.

Also, JFC, don't drink and ride.

Here's how fatal crashes have occurred over the past 10 years (nearly 700 deaths 2004-2013):

 

[Butch]

This is really good. Thank you all.

 

[NoneMoreBlack]

I'm with CD on this. Don't rely on the horn. Like him, I've been riding a loooonnnngggg time, and I rarely use it, and then usually to get the attention of another rider.

I use my horn all the time, when I am trying to click off my turn signal.

 

[corndog67]

Neill, my advice?

Ride with good riders. Not the guys that think they are fast and haul ass on 9, but I grew up with some Camel Pro guys, they hauled ass and rode very well. And would tell me when I was doing something stupid.

Ride a lot. Practice daily. Get a dirt bike, learn what happens when things start sliding around.

And ride more. Riding achools. Go race a Hare Scrambles. Or a motocross. Go have fun, when you are having fun, you are learning more.
One day, you'll say to yourself, "Hey, I'm doing alright. Those fucks on BARF might have been correct.

 

[DataDan]

This is huge. Riding within your personal limits should pretty much erase #1, #3, #4, #6. That's about 60% of your risk of a fatal right there. Given the speed of most lane splitters and the stats on that, staying under 15mph delta at reasonable speeds should keep you out of that one. At that point you're just dodging the fatals of crossing vehicles, head ons, and pedestrians/uturns, and all of these things are also mitigated by slowing the fuck down. That 9% "other" is actually what I'd be curious about, but that's a minority of fatals.

"Other" includes 9 categories. Sideswipe is 2.8% and actually should have been shown separately. More than half of those are the rider's fault.

The rest are no greater than 1.3% each: rearendEE (motorcycle hit from behind), cut-off, debris, critter (2 deer, 1 dog, 1 cow), fixed obstacle (e.g. Muni boarding island), mechanical, other (e.g. passenger fell from bike), and unknown (I couldn't figure out what happened from DOT database and news reports).

 

[mlm]

Lots of good stuff. Reminds me of this old article
http://www.motorcyclistonline.com/50-ways-to-save-your-life

 

[moto-rama]

Wear loud colors ( I have fluor green Fieldsheer), assume that everyone on the street is a homicidal maniac waiting for you to stop paying attention for two seconds. Has kept me crash free on the street since 63.

Loud is good.... and 1952 is a vintage year, for riders.

 

[mrmarklin]

All the RIP threads have got me thinking about why some riders never end up in an RIP thread and others do, some when very early in riding, others after years of riding.

So...to those of you who have lasted many years what strategies do you use?

Here's my personal recipe:

1 The Cager always has the right of way.
2 Avoid riding at night.
3 Avoid riding in the rain.
4 Avoid Blind spots.
5 Never ride under influence of any drug including of course alcohol.
6 I only split when traffic is stopped or almost so.
7 I'm not ATTGATT, but on long road trips with high speeds etc, I am. Locally, I let conditions and convenience dictate.
8 Both my bikes have upgraded lighting-LEDs. Very bright and noticeable.
9 Loud pipes save lives.

10 It bears repeating: THE CAGER HAS THE RIGHT OF WAY--ALWAYS.

 

[GAJ]

Excellent points already made.

I will add that never think about anything other than the ride and your active scanning.

If you find your mind drifting to something that happened at work, at home, what you're doing later figuratively smack yourself in the head.

Thinking about other things while riding is a recipe for disaster.

 

[Onebadscot]

My father drove big rigs for few years and taught me to drive (applies to riding as well) a half mile ahead of yourself. You will be surprised at how you can pick out the cages to avoid. Riding with tunnel vision or 50' in front of your bike is asking for it IMHO. I also ride conditions most hate, only so it's no big deal when I have no choice. I also never stop working on throttle control. My biggest problem I'm working on now is staying right on those blind lefts.

Have fun and be safe BARF

 

[louemc]

A lot of it has to do with luck.

I believe in making your own "luck".

From what I see, some riders make bad luck.

Others have learned how to make good luck.

 

[Archimedes]

A lot of it has to do with luck.

Yup. You can do everything possible to lower your risk and still have your number come up. And unfortunately, the real downside of motorcycling isn't just the increased probability of an accident. It's the size of the negative payoff often involved in the event of an accident, i.e., death or permanent disability. Expected return needs to consider both probability and size of the outcome, but most of us motorcyclists only focus on the first half of the equation. Even before my accident, I always said, if motorcyclists were honest about the second half, many of us wouldn't ride.

 

[louemc]

Yup. You can do everything possible to lower your risk and still have your number come up. And unfortunately, the real downside of motorcycling isn't just the increased probability of an accident. It's the size of the negative payoff often involved in the event of an accident, i.e., death or permanent disability. Expected return needs to consider both probability and size of the outcome, but most of us motorcyclists only focus on the first half of the equation. Even before my accident, I always said, if motorcyclists were honest about the second half, many of us wouldn't ride.

There is a possibility that a rider thinks they were doing everything possible..
But they Weren't.

 

[budman]

There is a possibility that a rider thinks they were doing everything possible..
But they Weren't.

You are always right... they should have been home in bed.

You have a religious issue Lou. I am getting tired of your poor taste, overblown ego and self righteousness.

 

[mean dad]

You are always right... they should have been home in bed.

You have a religious issue Lou. I am getting tired of your poor taste, overblown ego and self righteousness.

 

[Hooli]

You are always right... they should have been home in bed.

You have a religious issue Lou. I am getting tired of your poor taste, overblown ego and self righteousness.