The Electric Motorcycle Thread

[Tom G]

Multiple reasons, such as weight, not full fairing, bad service schedule, short battery warranty, Italian company.

I really don't want a motorcycle that needs maintenance more often than every 8K. Kind of defeats the point of having an EV.

Curious, what do you service? Shocks, chain, other than that?

 

[R3DS!X]

Curious, what do you service? Shocks, chain, other than that?

Fluid changes. They are aggressively scheduled and after doing one I plan on doing it every 10k from now on.

 

[mrzuzzo]

Curious, what do you service? Shocks, chain, other than that?

There is some oil change that you have to do on the Energica every 3K miles or something. It's absurd.

 

[R3DS!X]

There is some oil change that you have to do on the Energica every 3K miles or something. It's absurd.

They recommend 6k, and I think 10k is more reasonable.

 

[Tom G]

There is some oil change that you have to do on the Energica every 3K miles or something. It's absurd.

Oil for what? Electric motors have been around for over 100 years. There is no oil in them. The railways use AC traction motors because they don't need to replace the brushes. Now what oil change are you talking about. Even my BMW requires an oil change every 6k, not 3k. Confused.

 

[R3DS!X]

There is a reduction gearbox that has oil in it and the motor is oil cooled. There is also coolant for the charging box computer thing. brake fluid flush as well is done.

Some handsome devil with a big dick to match posted a write-up on the service here: https://www.electricmotorcycleforum.com/boards/index.php?topic=9816.msg87633#msg87633

 

[bigpoppa]

The Energicas use oil in two places:
1) The electric motor for cooling
2) The electric motor for lubricating the gear driven cams (not sure what this is, relaying what's in the service manual)

They're changed every 6k miles. It's 1.8l for the cooling oil and .1l for the gear driven cams.

 

[R3DS!X]

not sure what this is,

Its a gear reduction box. It means we get to have normal sized sprockets instead of the zero route where the pully/sprocket is nearly the size of the wheel.

 

[bigpoppa]

Thank you sir! I kind of thought that was what it was for but since I wasn't sure I decided to stick to what was in the owner's and service manuals.

 

[HadesOmega]

Exciting news here. Got an email from Damon Motorcycles they definitely look like they are not playing around in the electric motorcycle market. Looks like they acquired the technical assets from Mission Motors and hired some Alta engineers.

Mission + Alta + Damon =

The Future of Motorcycling
Since the start of 2020, our radical innovations in motorcycling have attracted over $13,000,000 USD in funding and preorders, representing several hundred preorders for the Hypersport Premier and HS models. We have also brought on top talent from the e-supermoto company Alta Motors.

Displayed here is the Mission R that shattered the AMA electric land speed record at the Bonneville Salt Flats. This motorcycle also set records at Laguna Seca in 2011, the 1/4 mile drag strip at Sonoma Raceway in 2012, and at the Isle of Man TT Zero race in 2014.
Now, we have acquired the IP portfolio of legacy company Mission Motors, former developer of high-density EV powertrains. This exciting acquisition gives us access to all of Mission Motors’ technology, research, and know-how including:

Mission Motors’ PM200 Electric Motor

Mission Inverter

Skyline Telematics


“The purchase of the Mission Motors IP will add to Damon’s capability to build the highest performance drive trains in motorcycling. Mission Motors was a technical leader and we are happy that some of that competitive DNA has passed into the Damon Hypersport.”

Derek Dorresteyn, COO at Damon Motorcycles
As we enter advanced development and the test validation phase, we're one step closer to building you the motorcycle of the future - today.

Ride On,
The Damon Motorcycles Team

 

[firstbuell]

way cool - is Derek related to local OG AMA dirt track racer Dick?

 

[Killroy1999]

Exciting news here. Got an email from Damon Motorcycles they definitely look like they are not playing around in the electric motorcycle market. Looks like they acquired the technical assets from Mission Motors and hired some Alta engineers.

I would hope that they make it to production in a safe and high quality way - better than Lightning

 

[firstbuell]

I would hope that they make it to production in a safe and high quality way - better than Lightning

??? “safe & high quality way” + “better than Lightning”.....
exactly what are you saying?

 

[Killroy1999]

??? “safe & high quality way” + “better than Lightning”.....
exactly what are you saying?

Lightning is having issues delivering what they promised and early reviewers have pointed out unsafe battery design. I think it was pointed out in the Lightning thread, but there are more reviews posted on Youtube.

 

[dittoalex]

My 2017 Zero 13.0 with 9000 miles needs a battery, it went from 30% left when I got home from my loop to now I have had to decrease my return slab from 70 mph to 65 mph and now the minimum 60 mph just to make it home with between 5% and 0%. Going by the SoC at the end of my ride, cold weather has permanently hurt the battery life as the final SoC has only kept getting worse. Moving away from electric bikes, battery durability just isn't there.

 

[mrzuzzo]

My 2017 Zero 13.0 with 9000 miles needs a battery, it went from 30% left when I got home from my loop to now I have had to decrease my return slab from 70 mph to 65 mph and now the minimum 60 mph just to make it home with between 5% and 0%. Going by the SoC at the end of my ride, cold weather has permanently hurt the battery life as the final SoC has only kept getting worse. Moving away from electric bikes, battery durability just isn't there.

Doesn't Zero give a 5-year warranty on that battery?

My understanding is they will upgrade you to a 14.4 battery free of charge if you're still under warranty.

Also, how relevant is Mission Motors' IP in these days given that it's ~5+ years old?

 

[mrzuzzo]

Electric Bikes are vaporware central these days.

Damon's promises are way too outlandish. The whole shape-shifting thing and the radar/vision/sensor-based rider aids are really not that important to most riders.

Just give us a bike with good range, power, comfort and modern basics like ABS and TC.

 

[firstbuell]

My 2017 Zero 13.0 with 9000 miles needs a battery, it went from 30% left when I got home from my loop to now I have had to decrease my return slab from 70 mph to 65 mph and now the minimum 60 mph just to make it home with between 5% and 0%. Going by the SoC at the end of my ride, cold weather has permanently hurt the battery life as the final SoC has only kept getting worse. Moving away from electric bikes, battery durability just isn't there.

I’m genuinely sad for you -
being a 1st adopter is rarely EZ.....

 

[Killroy1999]

My 2017 Zero 13.0 with 9000 miles needs a battery, it went from 30% left when I got home from my loop to now I have had to decrease my return slab from 70 mph to 65 mph and now the minimum 60 mph just to make it home with between 5% and 0%. Going by the SoC at the end of my ride, cold weather has permanently hurt the battery life as the final SoC has only kept getting worse. Moving away from electric bikes, battery durability just isn't there.

Doesn't Zero give a 5-year warranty on that battery?

My understanding is they will upgrade you to a 14.4 battery free of charge if you're still under warranty.

Also, how relevant is Mission Motors' IP in these days given that it's ~5+ years old?

dittoalex, if you started a thread on EMF, please crosslink it here.

My 2015 Zero SR battery with ~30,000 miles was replaced under warranty and my capacity when from the nominal 12.5 kWh to 14.4 -- that is nice.

I had rides with crazy SOC drops and limped around San Jose to find a charger to get home to Campbell.

I pulled the battery and bike logs and sent it to Zero and they basically said 'its showing signs of degradation - warranty repair for you'. I don't know what signs they are looking for, but I guess its "cutback" when you demand more power than what is available.

I have not heard this from two many Zero owners, so perhaps quality specs at the cell level can help. I'm not aware of a major design problem. Thermal cooling could help. Its easy to heat up a Zero to go into reduced power mode.

 

[Killroy1999]

Electric Bikes are vaporware central these days.

Damon's promises are way too outlandish. The whole shape-shifting thing and the radar/vision/sensor-based rider aids are really not that important to most riders.

Just give us a bike with good range, power, comfort and modern basics like ABS and TC.

Any new electric motorcycle should answer the following question really well.
1. How fast does it go?
2. What's the range?
3. How long does it take to recharge?
4. What does it cost?