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Any BARF Audiophiles?

Well Brichter, I'm a pretender too. I like music, buy used whenever possible, have a small/moderate budget, and just want a decent systems the family can enjoy. You're right though. While I get wealth is relative, the prices of some of the equipment I've seen is ludicrously obscene. :laughing

Question... I have a Schiit Multi Bit external DAC. Can I run a CD Player/Tranport with an internal DAC through my external DAC without causing a problem? A few of the units I'm looking at have internal DACs that seem less capable than mine. They also have only RCA or coax out; no OptiLink out if that makes a difference.
 
Those are good units, I have the Schiit Bifrost DAC and have been thinking about getting the MultiDAC upgrade for it, but at $250 it's pretty pricey.

There should be an optical or coax SPDIF input on your DAC, along with a USB input(not sure what model DAC you have, but I think they all have the same inputs).

To use a CD player as a transport only, you will need to make sure it has one of those 3 outputs on it. This setup will bypass the internal DAC and use the Schiit's DAC instead. For the Sonos box in my office, I run the optical output into the Bifrost and it sounds noticeably better than using the DAC in the Sonos unit.
 
Yup. The Multibit has all of the inputs you mention. So it sounds like the coax and optical out on a player/transport bypass the internal DAC. I'll look up SPDIF to understand what that is and verify the player/transports I'm looking at employ it. Thanks for pointing me! :thumbup

EDIT... Just looked at your Bifrost. Nice. johnkol's right. It'll never stop and I'll die broke. :cry
 
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DReg350 said:
As johnkol predicted I'm getting closer to start flushing hard earned greenbacks down the proverbial toilet in pursuit of perceived audio perfection.
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It's like watching myself from twenty years ago!

I don't know what your listening habits are, so I am not sure of how much help this would be, but I have a few equipment I am not using right now that you are welcome to borrow with no strings attached. PM me if you're interested.
 
DReg350 said:
What are your thoughts on the Emotiva ERC-3? I'm not a fan of the aesthetic, but the price and features look interesting.
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Sorry, I don't know Emotiva stuff. Too bad Shiit don't make transports. One of the founders, Mike Moffat, is from Theta Digital who used to make very good transports, so the expertise is there.

Any CD player with digital outputs should work as a transport with your DAC as long as the output/input types match - SPDIF/coax (RCA jacks), Toslink (optical), AES-EBU, USB.
 
Recently picked up a Harmon Kardon Citation 16 amp from the late seventies, the rare black faced model. I have dropped it off at the technician to be rebuilt.

Any suggestions for a pre-amp that would compliment its performance?

Thanks
 
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So, after scoring the Parks Audio Budgie twin tube phono preamp for less than a used Bellari VP130, I decided to put a CD player on hold for a bit, get a new phono cartridge and get my low end Thorens TD280 back online.

I've learned that I need a cartridge with an output voltage of 4mv or more to match well with my Jolida and Budgie, so the Denon DL110 high output moving coil I wanted is out. Seems I need to stay with moving magnet cartridge to get the suggested output voltage. Why? Because apparently my Jolida and early SN Budgie have high noise floor and an output voltage lower than 4mv results in unwanted... well, noise. Who knew? :dunno

Always something to learn. Just glad I'm asking questions before pulling the money trigger. So, now I'm looking at an obsolete no longer in production Ortofon OM 20 Super cartridge. Its a moving magnet cartridge, outputs that magic 4mv and it's been suggested that it's a much better match for my 280's tone arm than the newer Ortofon 2M Blue. Apparently they're nearly identical in sound quality, and they both use the same stylus profile. So it looks like this is where I'm heading.
 
DReg350 said:
...So, now I'm looking at an obsolete no longer in production Ortofon OM 20 Super cartridge. Its a moving magnet cartridge, outputs that magic 4mv and it's been suggested that it's a much better match for my 280's tone arm than the newer Ortofon 2M Blue. Apparently they're nearly identical in sound quality, and they both use the same stylus profile. So it looks like this is where I'm heading.
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Curious as to why it's a better match. I thought Ortofon replaced the OM line with the 2Ms awhile back. Is the OM20 new or used?

Vinyl Engine is a good site for cartridge and arm specs - Vinyl Engine. Search under Database for specs and manuals (you have to create a free acct to download manuals). The 2M Blue and OM20 look pretty similar - slight difference in compliance, which may make for a better match with your arm. - 2M Blue - OM20 and Super - Outputs of both meet or exceed your threshold and the tracking force is similar.
 
Several sources. Directly from Shannon Parks himself of Parks audio, designer and manufacturer of my Budgie preamp. Super cool dude. Mind you, I bought it used, not from him. He sent me a manual for free even though I offered to pay, then gave me the low down on my specific unit based on S/N, AND gave me cartridge advice based on my entire system. Told me to stay away from the Denon and moving coils. Next I spoke with Brian at Needledoctor.com. He suggested the OM-20 Super based on my entire system, but also my turntable and it's tone arm. After the suggestion I questioned why not the 2M Blue and that's when he said the OM-20 Super is a better match for my tone arm. Is it height, weight, tracking? Dunno. :dunno I'll have to ask him. I can get it cheaper on other sites, but Brian and the Needledoctor have been pretty damned helpful, so I think they've earned it. :thumbup

Look, my turntable is a POS, but it's what I have. And, I can't afford a new one, so I'm goin' with it. I've carefully cleaned it up, replaced the belt with a new OEM, found a tube preamp, so a cartridge is the final puzzle piece to get this thing going and then discover that all my records are scratched beyond playability. :kicknuts :laughing.

Thought this was a funny review of it... "Legendary Thorens build quality on the cheap - slightly unsubtle sound but eminently liveable with and very good value - TD 280 mkII £190 HiFi Choice 1992" :laughing
 
Well, sounds like you're using good sources. Agreed to stay away from moving coil their output is way too low. I don't know why they don't think there any other cartridges are going to work good for your turntable, I happen to prefer the Grados if I'm not going to spend an arm and a leg...
 
So is the OM20 new or used? I think they stopped production around 2010. If it's used, you'd want to know the hours it's already played. The compliance (how easy the stylus wiggles in the cartridge body) and maybe weight would be the things that matter for the tonearm. I'm sure you got good advice, certainly more knowledgeable than mine. Just curious why they advised away from the 2M Blue when they look so close on paper.

Hey, don't knock old turntables. I have an early 80s vintage AR table with an old Signet cartridge in a system and like them.
 
brichter said:
Agreed to stay away from moving coil their output is way too low.
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Not universally true; there are High Output Moving Coil cartridges whose output is the industry standard of 2mV (same as Moving Magnet cartridges).
 
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I was surprised, but new OM Supers are still readily available online all over the place. Apparently the OM Super body is universal and the styli (is that a word?) are interchangeable (10, 20, 30, or 40). Reviews I read after the suggestion seems to indicate most prefer the 20 and 30. Who know? :dunno

Have a few friends who love Grado. Silver1 Prestige and Gold to be specific. Thought about those too.

Seems to me that some vinyl folks roll cartridges like some amp folks roll tubes. I'm hoping to get it right, to make one choice and run with it for at least a few years.

I've got a few more questions for Needledoctor and hope to pull the trigger on something in the next day or two. Then the fun of alignment. :laughing
 
DReg350 said:
I've learned that I need a cartridge with an output voltage of 4mv or more to match well with my Jolida and Budgie
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A Moving Magnet phono preamp is supposed to take the standard MM output (2mV), and convert it to standard Line Input of 2V -- so a 1000x amplification.

If they are telling you that you need a cartridge with an output of 4mV, this means that their phono preamp section can only amplify the signal 500x. However, Line preamp sections are not that sensitive, so even a 1V input is enough to drive the power amp sections to full power.

My suspicion therefore is that it is not just the noise floor that is elevated in those amps, but they have a lot of other problems that result in an elevated noise floor and an unusual requirement for very high MM output voltage.
 
johnkol said:
... My suspicion therefore is that it is not just the noise floor that is elevated in those amps, but they have a lot of other problems that result in an elevated noise floor and an unusual requirement for very high MM output voltage.
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I think you're right on target. He makes one now specifically for MCs, the Budgie Hybrid. He did say mine is a very early model that had some problems that were corrected in later models. May turn out to be a bad buy, but I'm trying to hold the entry cost down and see if I still enjoy vinyl. If so I'll upgrade again down the road, or maybe... this will turn out to be just fine. :dunno
 
DReg350 said:
I think you're right on target. He makes one now specifically for MCs, the Budgie Hybrid. He did say mine is a very early model that had some problems that were corrected in later models. May turn out to be a bad buy, but I'm trying to hold the entry cost down and see if I still enjoy vinyl. If so I'll upgrade again down the road, or maybe... this will turn out to be just fine. :dunno
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Not sure if this helps but you can buy a separate phono amp and go through a standard line input on your pre-amp.
 
johnkol said:
Not universally true; there are High Output Moving Coil cartridges whose output is the industry standard of 2mV (same as Moving Magnet cartridges).
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Correct, but those are HOMC, not MC. Different classification, and I'm sure that's why they told him to stay away from them. ;-)
 
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