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Ninja H2?

TTTom said:
I think that's just some artists conception... the Cameron article talks about the fuel being injected upstream of the supercharger.

I'm not sure what that would even look like but I don't think it would resemble the conventional injector layout at all.
Click to expand...

Injecting fuel upstream of the fan makes no sense - I am willing to stand corrected, but from a performance and fuel economy point of view this would make no sense, not to mention that blow-off valve would have to exhaust through a carbon canister to be CARB certified.

Also, artist drawing or not, the illustration in Kawasaki's blown motorcycle patent has an inline four.

Again this is all speculation - I guess their marketing ploy is working :mad

/Soren
 
TTTom said:
I think that's just some artists conception... the Cameron article talks about the fuel being injected upstream of the supercharger.

I'm not sure what that would even look like but I don't think it would resemble the conventional injector layout at all.
Click to expand...

What the hell is the reasoning for that with modern engine design, electronics and injectors?
 
sjuels said:
Injecting fuel upstream of the fan makes no sense - I am willing to stand corrected, but from a performance and fuel economy point of view this would make no sense, not to mention that blow-off valve would have to exhaust through a carbon canister to be CARB certified.

Also, artist drawing or not, the illustration in Kawasaki's blown motorcycle patent has an inline four.

Again this is all speculation - I guess their marketing ploy is working :mad

/Soren
Click to expand...

aminalmutha said:
What the hell is the reasoning for that with modern engine design, electronics and injectors?
Click to expand...

Read the Cameron article... the injection is upstream so the subsequent fuel evaporation cools the air mix enough that you don't need an intercooler downstream of the supercharger. Intercoolers are fine for cars where you've got more room under the hood but they'd be pretty bulky for a motorcycle.

He mentions that most supercharged WWII airplanes were deisgned that way.
 
TTTom said:
Read the Cameron article... the injection is upstream so the subsequent fuel evaporation cools the air mix enough that you don't need an intercooler downstream of the supercharger. Intercoolers are fine for cars where you've got more room under the hood but they'd be pretty bulky for a motorcycle.

He mentions that most supercharged WWII airplanes were deisgned that way.
Click to expand...

:thumb up Worked swell on the blown and injected, fuel dragsters as well.

Big ass Hilborne injectors with velocity stacks on top the roots blower.
 
Well, there are packaging reasons for the dragsters aircraft as well. I could see maybe having a multi-stage system where you inject fuel ahead of the blower as well as closer to the cylinder, but just injecting ahead of the blower severely limits your ability to precisely control fuel metering and atomization. And if there's ever been a big development over the years, it's that. He's talking about ancient aircraft and someone else brings up ancient dragsters. Neither have the same issues as trying to make a blown liter motor work in a compact package.

One absolutely could use a small intercooler on a motorcycle. Motorcycles already have large engine coolant heat exchangers as well as oil heat exchangers, so using one for a blower I don't think would be a huge deal. Hell, you could even have the radiator do double duty if so desired.

Anyways, I would be a little surprised if fuel was injected only before the blower. Possible, but I think unlikely.
 
TTTom said:
Read the Cameron article... the injection is upstream so the subsequent fuel evaporation cools the air mix enough that you don't need an intercooler downstream of the supercharger. Intercoolers are fine for cars where you've got more room under the hood but they'd be pretty bulky for a motorcycle.

He mentions that most supercharged WWII airplanes were deisgned that way.
Click to expand...

Reading their patent, it is clear that the fuel is injected in the throttle bodies - which is after the supercharger (they also mention secondary direct injection, when the engine is under load, which indicates potential high boost).

The pre-WWII design, which relies on cold ambient air and carburators, is really not a candidate for a CARB compliant, fuel-injected design.

My quick calculations for the size of an intercooler, to deal with a boost that would take a liter bike to 240hp+ shows that they can get away with a very small and cheap cooler - much cheaper than the cost of variable timing, anti knock, gear-driven supercharger.

And, yeah the hype seems to be working on me, because I have started dreaming of all the mods that can be done to a bike like this (400hp anyone?).

/Soren
 
Smash Allen said:
Oh, ya I agree with you about the harder engineering. I would guess the added complexity to the engine wasn't worth it when gas was so cheap.
Click to expand...

Superchargers and turbos don't help with fuel economy. In fact, they do the opposite. Except in car makers' marketing brochures these days: "yes, suuuuure... you can get a large peak power number and a large MPG number." What they forget to mention is "...but you can't get power and fuel economy at the same time."
 
After watching the most recent video touting KHI's experience with gas turbines and relating that to the new H2, it should be very interesting to see how they accomplish this goal in a production bike. I imagine the limitations they will need to impose (for CARB) as an example will restrict free form engineering.
 
From one of the guys on my other forum:

To recap what Ricky Gadson said today:

- Less than 500 bikes will be made PERIOD
- Will have the highest HP we will most likely see in our lifetime
- Will NOT be a "race" version of the bike - BUT he did say lets see?
- It will REVOLUTIONIZE the motorcycle industry
- It will be the Bugatti of the motorcycle industry
- It will be faster than anything ever made on 2 wheels
- It will have a soft launch here in the US a couple weeks later in Orlando - GOING!!!


"If you are interested in buying the H2 you better get your check book out QUICKLY!"
 
rosemont83 said:
From one of the guys on my other forum:

To recap what Ricky Gadson said today:

- Less than 500 bikes will be made PERIOD
- Will have the highest HP we will most likely see in our lifetime
- Will NOT be a "race" version of the bike - BUT he did say lets see?
- It will REVOLUTIONIZE the motorcycle industry
- It will be the Bugatti of the motorcycle industry
- It will be faster than anything ever made on 2 wheels
- It will have a soft launch here in the US a couple weeks later in Orlando - GOING!!!

"If you are interested in buying the H2 you better get your check book out QUICKLY!"
Click to expand...


this is great news!

I wonder if they'll sell em online, thru Costco, or.....?
 
rosemont83 said:
From one of the guys on my other forum:

To recap what Ricky Gadson said today:

- Less than 500 bikes will be made PERIOD
- Will have the highest HP we will most likely see in our lifetime
- Will NOT be a "race" version of the bike - BUT he did say lets see?
- It will REVOLUTIONIZE the motorcycle industry
- It will be the Bugatti of the motorcycle industry
- It will be faster than anything ever made on 2 wheels
- It will have a soft launch here in the US a couple weeks later in Orlando - GOING!!!


"If you are interested in buying the H2 you better get your check book out QUICKLY!"
Click to expand...

My next newb question; are there tires currently in production or existence which will put that kind of power to the asphalt? Or will this thing's traction control be working hard 100% of the time?
 
rosemont83 said:
From one of the guys on my other forum:

To recap what Ricky Gadson said today:
- Less than 500 bikes will be made PERIOD
- Will have the highest HP we will most likely see in our lifetime
Click to expand...


- Meh, warranty nightmare.
- My NA makes just as much HP, our BF makes almost 3x.
I highly highly doubt it will be the highest HP proddy bike ever produced.
And I'm a huge Kawi Fan Boy. H U G E.

Will I buy one? Maybe. I might buy 2.
 
Papi said:
- Meh, warranty nightmare.
- My NA makes just as much HP, our BF makes almost 3x.
I highly highly doubt it will be the highest HP proddy bike ever produced.
And I'm a huge Kawi Fan Boy. H U G E.

Will I buy one? Maybe. I might buy 2.
Click to expand...

7 days to find out for sure.

You guys are on some next level rocket ship shit though. Haha
 
The Vol. 8 video shows the exhaust in a 4 - 2 - 1 configuration, exactly like the illustrations in the patent, so I would put my money on that what we will see is that the illustrations are engineering renderings, not just an artists illustrations.

I am not sure why I am so fascinated with this, but there is something about blown engines ... and redheads ... it's just hard to not think about it.

Also, if this is a limited production run; 500 was mentioned, then I cannot imagine that a more pedestrian version will come out after that - the investment in R&D and tooling is just way too great, to just deep six it.

/Soren
 
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