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"Oriental" - is it derogatory?

cycle61 said:
I was just thinking about that thread the other day, but having already been suspended once for digging up locked threads, decided not to mention it.

The casual intolerance and racism of the elderly is occasionally shocking, but a good reminder of how far we've come in many ways.
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I dunno if I consider a culture that goes apeshit over "microaggressions" to be exactly correlated with progress...

Let's practice tolerance and acceptance, people.
 
Abyss said:
I dunno if I consider a culture that goes apeshit over "microaggressions" to be exactly correlated with progress...

Let's practice tolerance and acceptance, people.
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I dunno if I'd consider the desire for cultural competency "microaggression".

The word "oriental" is an attempt to put all the focus on someone's physical or behavioral characteristics, rather than simply where they're from. It's almost like calling Germans Krauts. Even if you didn't mean to insult, you are being insulting by using a word that you probably didn't even research. If you had researched it you'd know that years ago it was used to insult, and still is by older people.
 
A try to find that photo I took of a Korean Leprechaun at Bay to Breakers a couple of years back. Talk about cultural insensitivity! :nchantr


:laughing
 
Reli said:
It's typically only used by old farts, many of whom served in Vietnam or Korea and used derogatory names for the enemy.

Why can't they just say Asian? The fact that they prefer saying Oriental even though it's been eliminated from acceptable terminology for many years speaks volumes about their intentions.
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Asian wasn't a word used back then. Oriental was common usage. The expression "old farts" is offensive and derogatory, and used by people who haven't learned any better. Their intentions are obvious.

It's "age impaired", "senior leaders", or "venerable aged" now. Get your shit together, Bro.

PS: My family is mostly Kraut with lots of Kraut relatives and I call myself a Kraut sometimes. It's from "Sauerkraut".
 
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kongjie said:
It's not inherently offensive, but it became so over time. Americans used it for a long time to describe anything/anyone from the east, and as such it was a gross generalization, and also an exoticization. Someone who is Chinese has a distinct identity from someone who is Japanese, or Korean.

Furthermore, it falls into the class of words that are used to describe things that are "not us."

It's like "colored." We're white, they're colored. Well, in fact, I've rarely seen anyone who is white.
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One word encompassing anyone from the east = Oriental = BAD.
One word encompassing anyone from the east = Asian = GOOD.
 
Reli said:
You're right, apologies for the fart.

But my dad's side is German, and does not like the word "Kraut". It was used offensively towards them for many years after the war.
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Funny how that happens when you wage aggressive war against the world.

Edit:

I prefer the term "Jerry."
 
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OldBlade said:
The term oriental can be applied to inanimate objects (furniture, cuisine, etc), but not people.
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I've heard exactly two people use the term Oriental when talking about people. My grandad born in 1920 and an Oriental guy I work with. :twofinger
 
mean dad said:
One word encompassing anyone from the east = Oriental = BAD.
One word encompassing anyone from the east = Asian = GOOD.
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It's actually pretty ludicrous to call both a Turk and a Thai living here "Asian-Americans."
 
i call them "wong wasions" cuz when i was 17 i worked valet at oakridge and they would always drive down the one way side going the wrong way. hence wong wasians
 
enki said:
It's actually pretty ludicrous to call both a Turk and a Thai living here "Asian-Americans."
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Although it isn't explicit in the census forms, Turkish, Persian and Arabs are "white non Hispanic" according to the us gov
 
enki said:
It's actually pretty ludicrous to call both a Turk and a Thai living here "Asian-Americans."
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You wouldn't. Most Americans would probably call Turks "Middle Eastern". It's possible that could be considered offensive -- I don't know. But at least it's better than Arabs, since Turks aren't even Arab to begin with.
 
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Seems a bit of a stretch to take offense at being called oriental. If I wanted to offend someone from East Asia (which I don't), it would never occur to me to use that word.

I think many times, taking offense is just an excuse to put down someone you don't like.

kongjie said:
...
It's like "colored." We're white, they're colored.
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And yet, "person of color" is perfectly PC.

:dunno
 
rodr said:
Seems a bit of a stretch to take offense at being called oriental. If I wanted to offend someone from East Asia (which I don't), it would never occur to me to use that word.

I think many times, taking offense is just an excuse to put down someone you don't like.
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That may be. "Oriental" is certainly falling into disuse today, but in the times I can recall having heard people use it, they weren't being derogatory.

A Japanese-American guy I used to work with would, lets say, perpetuate racial stereotypes behind the wheel. He knew it and when he'd do something goofy, he'd chuckle and say, "DWO." It was a self-deprecating poke at the stereotype, but the "O" wasn't itself a slur; it was how he referred to his ethnicity.
 
I remember the turning point when the word was discarded for good by the Boomers, in the early 70s, with all the identity politics and what was called "consciousness-raising." I was in high school and we had a budding radical know-it-all trouble maker dude, who was always busting everyone's balls for not being radical enough in my small town of Martinez.

The standard retort was: "well, its okay if we [meaning mainstream Euro-Americans] are willing to be called Occidentals."

In other words, it was a matter of opening our minds and not being Euro-centric. Same thing went on with the term "flesh-tone" regarding band-aids. Using those terms was seen as ignorant and Establishment.

So, henceforth, younger people concerned with being cool dropped the term, leaving just the older ones to be the "problem." Of course it probably took longer in other states and rural areas...

Bottom line is that even though both Oriental and Asian do not specify nationality, at least the latter is more geographically specific, and less a Victorian/colonial construct. Not using Oriental disassociates yourself from the worst of colonlialist thinking.....We got rid of Sambo around the same time. And got embarassed by Charlie Chan movies. Also, the word "squaw" for Native American women. All of those things which either infantilized, marginalized or otherwise demeaned non-whites were held in a critical light and mostly rejected.

The insult of using Oriental isn't so much a direct slur on character, but rather just anonymizes them. It's like referring to your wife not by her actual name, but as "the Little Woman" or "the ball and chain." That type o' thing. It always implies this power player using the term who is "okay" while everyone else is not exactly. In other words, a white man.

Took on much quicker out here on the Pacific Rim. I think New Yorkers, who pride themselves on hipness, lagged behind the West Coast on stuff like this.
 
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