Ticketed for not yielding to a ped (sting op)

[masameet]

In that kind of a stop, would a motor LEO have his lights flashing?

I know from another thread you posted in that the flashing lights on a BMW LEO bike are kinda hard to detect by motorists.

Anyway that chick wasn't just stupid, she's also frickin' blind -- to her side mirrors and turning her stupid head.

 

[LongGoneJohn]

In that kind of a stop, would a motor LEO have his lights flashing?

I know from another thread you posted in that the flashing lights on a BMW LEO bike are kinda hard to detect by motorists.

Anyway that chick wasn't just stupid, she's also frickin' blind -- to her side mirrors and turning her stupid head.

They're only hard to see from a distance when the front headlight is washing out the reds/blues.

I know personally that San Rafael has a lot of extra lighting on their BMW's and I'm sure that wasn't the issue.

Justin could have had a loud speaker saying "I am right here!" and she still would have hit him. Some people are just that stupid.

 

[nvp]

Here's an example from yesterday (April 3) of the unintended consequences of a motorist violating the anti-gridlock law (I guess that means CVC section 22526) (but no mention of photo lights at the intersection):

Wow... talk about how a thread can get off topic. What, even remotely, does this have to do with the topic of the thread?

There are a few thoughts I will add to what (that is on topic) has been discussed:

- I have been doing this commute for 5 years and have NEVER seen someone CHOOSE to cross at this intersection. Why? Because, in short, it's the most dangerous option for a ped in the area. Why not cross at a light? I don't get it. Why is it even LEGAL to cross a 6-lane road with no signal in the middle of rush hour when there are better options within a block?

- I will fight this in court because I was was put in a fabricated scenario that would not have existed in reality. And further, I reacted, given available visibility vs. distance to the cross walk, in the most safe manner possible. And lastly, the ped was entirely safe (SAFER) given my decision. I do believe it's a form of entrapment for these reasons. And I have never felt that way before in my 24 years of being a licensed driver/rider.

I'll let you all know how it turns out. Thanks for your comments.

 

[Marlowe]

- I have been doing this commute for 5 years and have NEVER seen someone CHOOSE to cross at this intersection. Why? Because, in short, it's the most dangerous option for a ped in the area. Why not cross at a light? I don't get it. Why is it even LEGAL to cross a 6-lane road with no signal in the middle of rush hour when there are better options within a block?

My understanding of your original post is that this was a crosswalk sting operation...are you now telling us the officer was jaywalking?

If so, you might have a leg to stand on, but are you seriously planning on telling a judge that no sane person would cross in a crosswalk? You might rethink your strategy here...

 

[nvp]

My understanding of your original post is that this was a crosswalk sting operation...are you now telling us the officer was jaywalking?

If so, you might have a leg to stand on, but are you seriously planning on telling a judge that no sane person would cross in a crosswalk? You might rethink your strategy here...

Never said there wasn't a crosswalk. There was no light. Thanks for your perspective, though.

 

[jordan]

Too bad you can't hold the cops responsible if you slam on the breaks and get hit from behind. They are "acting in the name of safety" after all right? Yeah right, they are making the street MORE dangerous with this crap.

I bet these stings would stop real quick if that was the case and nobody would miss them.

 

[nvp]

Too bad you can't hold the cops responsible if you slam on the breaks and get hit from behind. They are "acting in the name of safety" after all right? Yeah right, they are making the street MORE dangerous with this crap.

I bet these stings would stop real quick if that was the case and nobody would miss them.

Amen. I feel the same way.

 

[SurfAwave69]

- I have been doing this commute for 5 years and have NEVER seen someone CHOOSE to cross at this intersection. Why? Because, in short, it's the most dangerous option for a ped in the area. Why not cross at a light? I don't get it. Why is it even LEGAL to cross a 6-lane road with no signal in the middle of rush hour when there are better options within a block?



I'll let you all know how it turns out. Thanks for your comments.

My hypothesis:

Some folks are too lazy to walk that extra block to a safe crossing.


Keep us posted!

 

[nweaver]

- I will fight this in court because I was was put in a fabricated scenario that would not have existed in reality. And further, I reacted, given available visibility vs. distance to the cross walk, in the most safe manner possible. And lastly, the ped was entirely safe (SAFER) given my decision. I do believe it's a form of entrapment for these reasons. And I have never felt that way before in my 24 years of being a licensed driver/rider.

Since a vehicle was ahead of you in the other lane and did stop in time, you will be hard pressed to make this case in court. After all, thats the whole heart of your argument why you didn't see the pedestrian until too late.

It is your legal right to try, but unless the officer(s) don't show up, I'd bet you won't win.

 

[Marlowe]

Never said there wasn't a crosswalk. There was no light. Thanks for your perspective, though.

To be honest, I'm not trying to bag on you here...just noting that I think the judge's reaction may be along the lines of "wait, a reasonable person should not cross the street in a marked crosswalk because it's not safe?" and then go on to observe that other people were able to stop and if they aren't safe it's because people roll through the crosswalk, like you did, and I just don't see that conversation going well for you at all...

Good luck though.

 

[JPM]

To be honest, I'm not trying to bag on you here...just noting that I think the judge's reaction may be along the lines of "wait, a reasonable person should not cross the street in a marked crosswalk because it's not safe?" Then there should be more enforcement there so people can safely cross there.

FIXED.

 

[MysterYvil]

Originally Posted by Marlowe
To be honest, I'm not trying to bag on you here...just noting that I think the judge's reaction may be along the lines of "wait, a reasonable person should not cross the street in a marked crosswalk because it's not safe?" Then there should be more enforcement there so lazy and/or stupid folks can be more thoroughly coddled, politicians and police can be viewed as "doing something" about a media-spawned problem, and extra civic revenue can be easily generated.

FIXED.

Fixed your "fixed."

 

[MysterYvil]

I spend a ton of time as a ped in SF; I don't have any difficulty finding lights to cross at, and on the rare occasions I feel "forced" to cross at a non-regulated light, I rely on the training I received from my parents and schools: I FREAKIN' YIELD TO CARS, EVEN IF I LEGALLY HAVE THE RIGHT-OF-WAY.

Duh.

There's about a million BARF threads about NOT duking it out with cars just because you have the right-of-way, simply because if you tangle the moto loses... Double standard much? Is SFPD going to help us out by stinging those who violate our right-of-way? Not very likely...

The whole ped-sting thing is mainly public relations, with a bit of extra revenue for the mix (and to anyone who says tickets don't raise revenue- give me a break and prove it!).

It's certainly not about safety, because if SF genuinely cared about ped safety they'd look into perhaps ticketing the HUGE number of peds who don't heed any traffic laws or safety basics.

 

[masameet]

You guys are so ridiculous.

I was struck while walking in a crosswalk. The light was green for me. And I'd just walked by the island median when I decided to turn my head to see the cars that were making a left turn behind me. If I hadn't paused for a second, the first car would've nailed me. As the driver was doing at least 35 mph. The second driver did brake to a near stop when she finally saw me. But she still hit me. And you know what? After she got out of her car, she apologized. And then she cried. I guess she realized that she could have maimed me if she hadn't braked. She was sorry for her inattentiveness and I didn't hate her for her poor driving or for my injury.

You can say all you want about pedestrians. But I'm a rider too. If I'd been on my motorcycle and some fool in a car decided to turn left in front of me and struck me as I was riding through an intersection, would I be a "lazy" and "stupid" rider because I just happened to be in some inconsiderate, impatient scofflaw's way?

 

[ZXR400SP]

Didn't read all the posts, seemed to be a waste of time, read two pages and skipped to the end. I've covered several ped Xing operations in Stockton. I don't think they're doing it for revenue, I've seen the decoy ped give more than one driver a break that didn't have a good view of him. I've also almost seen the ped nearly get hit by someone who could see them for at least a block but didn't even slow down. From my perspective they usually do it when they get a lot of complaints in a certain area. I know from personal experience it can be difficult to cross at some local crosswalks without the risk of getting hit.

 

[MysterYvil]

You guys are so ridiculous.

I was struck while walking in a crosswalk. The light was green for me. And I'd just walked by the island median when I decided to turn my head to see the cars that were making a left turn behind me. If I hadn't paused for a second, the first car would've nailed me. As the driver was doing at least 35 mph.

35 mph, while doing a left turn...and us "guys are so ridiculous?" What intersection did this [alleged incident] transpire at? Come to think of it, my mother's gardener's niece's fiance's second son from his first marriage had THE EXACT SAME THING HAPPEN!

The second driver did brake to a near stop when she finally saw me. But she still hit me. And you know what? After she got out of her car, she apologized. And then she cried. I guess she realized that she could have maimed me if she hadn't braked. She was sorry for her inattentiveness and I didn't hate her for her poor driving or for my injury.

Guess she wasn't doing 35 mph, if she managed to brake to a near stop...

You can say all you want about pedestrians. But I'm a rider too. If I'd been on my motorcycle and some fool in a car decided to turn left in front of me and struck me as I was riding through an intersection, would I be a "lazy" and "stupid" rider because I just happened to be in some inconsiderate, impatient scofflaw's way?

Extrapolating from your statement, you think elementary precautions are not needed because of what's written in the DMV manuals?

 

[masameet]

Just one more thought to personalize the reason for pedestrian crosswalk stings. I'm going to quote a BARF LEO who posted a few years ago in this forum about his own father:

He was killed as he crossed a street in a marked crosswalk. He made it through three lanes of traffic, across a painted median and two more lanes before getting hit. The guy who killed him got a whopping 1 year in County Jail for involuntary manslaughter. To top it off, the guy had no insurance, no money, and no job.

nvp, you may think you were unjustly ticketed. But I seriously doubt you'll beat your ticket.

 

[MysterYvil]

Didn't read all the posts, seemed to be a waste of time, read two pages and skipped to the end. I've covered several ped Xing operations in Stockton. I don't think they're doing it for revenue, I've seen the decoy ped give more than one driver a break that didn't have a good view of him. I've also almost seen the ped nearly get hit by someone who could see them for at least a block but didn't even slow down. From my perspective they usually do it when they get a lot of complaints in a certain area. I know from personal experience it can be difficult to cross at some local crosswalks without the risk of getting hit.

I wish "a lot of complaints" would get some action here...

Can't even get SFPD to respond to 911 calls about thugs in the actual act of breaking in doors, or presently-occurring daylight beat-down robberies, but ped stings they can manage...

 

[MysterYvil]

Just one more thought to personalize the reason for pedestrian crosswalk stings. I'm going to quote a BARF LEO who posted a few years ago in this forum about his own father:


nvp, you may think you were unjustly ticketed. But I seriously doubt you'll beat your ticket.

Ummm, it's not really a quote without attribution.

 

[Blind_Io]

You guys are so ridiculous.

I was struck while walking in a crosswalk. The light was green for me. And I'd just walked by the island median when I decided to turn my head to see the cars that were making a left turn behind me. If I hadn't paused for a second, the first car would've nailed me. As the driver was doing at least 35 mph. The second driver did brake to a near stop when she finally saw me. But she still hit me. And you know what? After she got out of her car, she apologized. And then she cried. I guess she realized that she could have maimed me if she hadn't braked. She was sorry for her inattentiveness and I didn't hate her for her poor driving or for my injury.

You can say all you want about pedestrians. But I'm a rider too. If I'd been on my motorcycle and some fool in a car decided to turn left in front of me and struck me as I was riding through an intersection, would I be a "lazy" and "stupid" rider because I just happened to be in some inconsiderate, impatient scofflaw's way?

I've also had a moron pedestrian walk backwards into traffic against the light. Nearly caused me to dump my bike trying to avoid him, and I walked with a limp for two weeks because I jammed my leg down to keep it up. Now why don't the cops enforce the other side of the coin and ticket Jay Walkers?

Rule #1: Don't bet your life against the laws of physics.