PGE our friendly Bay Area Utility

[Bay Arean]

Yeah, it is funny how being held to account and requiring corrections after 50 years of outrageous corruption and gross negligence is super hard.

It seems ridiculously obvious but it must be said: to me, they want their high salaries and profitable quarterlies and whatever fixes and upgrades must be done have to be transferred to the suckers who are in thrall to the original proprietary public utility condition. They get their way, every time.

It’s not like we can take our business elsewhere. That’s why the free market, yay capitalism argument rankles. And this ain’t political.

It seems like being a “public utility” infers strategic planning and spending at the expense of immediate returns. I don’’t own stock in them but if I have an investment in a public utility I would expect some some flat profit years to ensure an long-term good investment, not a litigation-plagued shitshow with shiny commercials to imply otherwise.

What am I missing here? Why is there even a PUC over them? They get what they want.

 

[Climber]

Perception is everything, as long as they are perceived to have an entity that is holding them accountable, they are golden.

it is the same kind of thing as supposedly capitalistic forces at work when the reality is that collusion is the name of the game, assuring high profits for all involved, bypassing the downside of real competition.

 

[Bay Arean]

Perception is everything, as long as they are perceived to have an entity that is holding them accountable, they are golden.

Sounds right to me but hey, I am just one of the torch and pitchfork crowd. I need Ned Beatty to explain to me what I don’t understand.

 

[scratchpad]

Strange that such an opinion would feel condescending to you. I'd say that people shouldn't give strangers that kind of power over them, but I don't want to make you any more cranky.

Energy (electricity and fuel) yes. Because of the way the country is structured with the consolidation of agriculture and because we import so much food from other countries, it makes energy necessary for social stability. An apple travels 2500 miles on average before it gets to you, so energy is necessary to eat in our current setup.

Yes, the native americans are doing great.

i didnt feel any certain way other than a questioning, trying to understand your way of thinking, attitude.

So that fuel, energy, food, water sources can be run by government funded businesses? Our taxes would go up, no? Do you think the cost would be less and better service?

When PG&e was going through bankruptcy a handful of years ago after the fires the masses were saying they should be taken over and ran by the government. These same people that think its PG&Es responsibility to come on their private property and trim/cut their personal trees that havnt been maintained. Yes, you will pay one way or another for that.

Lets make everything free. That sounds better.

 

[scratchpad]

Some investment has been made, but even by PG&E's own admission there is a lot more that needs to be done - and they're looking to ratepayers to fund it. Which is an obscenity given that much of the need for that remedial infrastructure work is the result of their own criminal negligence and mismanagement.

In a competitive marketplace, PG&E would fail and a better managed business would take its place. But because of their position as a monopoly public utility, that obviously can't happen. Thus given that negligence they do not deserve to make a profit.

Like 10,000 miles of underground lines

I think they are managing just fine. In 2021 they hired on someone who "leads with love" and she became the highest paid IOU CEO at over $51 million and she continues to be one of the highest paid CEOs of utility companies. Profits are gong to the wigs pockets.

Have more love in your heart and maybe you'll get paid more and pay less with better service for social stability needs.

 

[Eldritch]

It seems ridiculously obvious but it must be said: to me, they want their high salaries and profitable quarterlies and whatever fixes and upgrades must be done have to be transferred to the suckers who are in thrall to the original proprietary public utility condition. They get their way, every time.

It’s not like we can take our business elsewhere. That’s why the free market, yay capitalism argument rankles. And this ain’t political.

It seems like being a “public utility” infers strategic planning and spending at the expense of immediate returns. I don’’t own stock in them but if I have an investment in a public utility I would expect some some flat profit years to ensure an long-term good investment, not a litigation-plagued shitshow with shiny commercials to imply otherwise.

What am I missing here? Why is there even a PUC over them? They get what they want.

https://www.pionline.com/pension-funds/pge-power-327-million-pension-plan

 

[budman]

Looks like PG & E should take over social security.

 

[Eldritch]

Looks like PG & E should take over social security.

LOL, quite the opposite actually.

 

[budman]

Well.. they are funding the retirement of their employees on the backs of citizens.. seems kind of a natural to me.

 

[Bay Arean]

If they are giving true pensions to all of their employees, why, that’s the first positive thing I heard about that outfit.

OTOH, all the rest of employees in the service area relegated to 401K plans or worse are, once again, paying them to have a superior golden age. But at least the brave linemen get their reward.

 

[Eldritch]

Well.. they are funding the retirement of their employees on the backs of citizens.. seems kind of a natural to me.

It is typical of most Union organizations. They use legislation to falsely inflate costs in order to fund fiscal models of outdated pyramid schemes that should be illegal, also known as Pension plans. These plans are sometimes also known as, "Boomer Looting."

 

[budman]

Boomer looting...

Considering the first pension was in 1875 I am sure it was the boomers at the American Express Company. Soon utilities, banking and manufacturing companies also began to provide pensions to obtain and keep quality employees.

The Boomers were not really involved although sometimes I do feel 150 years old.

 

[Eldritch]

Boomer looting...

Considering the first pension was in 1875 I am sure it was the boomers at the American Express Company. Soon utilities, banking and manufacturing companies also began to provide pensions to obtain and keep quality employees.

The Boomers were not really involved although sometimes I do feel 150 years old.

Well, the thing about the con of pyramid schemes is, a lot of people who get in early do very well.

The obvious fact is that the pension benefits offered to Boomers retiring in the 1980's and 1990's are nothing compared to what was being offered in 1875, the account has to be held to them for demanding the kind of benefits that destroyed the once great City of Detroit and literally bankrupt the City of Vallejo.

The main problem with pyramid schemes is, in order to function, the base that is flowing cash up the pyramid needs to expend indefinitely. When expansion slows to be smaller than the layer previous, the pyramid collapses and the smaller layer takes the losses as the pyramid crumbles.

The Boomers are the ones to stopped expanding for the sake of self interest. Gen X kids are that layer of collapse.

Boomer looting.

 

[budman]

Won't argue... I agree the Gubment took it to a whole notha level.

Boomer Looting is funny. I am sorry you have to live through that man.

 

[Maddevill]

i didnt feel any certain way other than a questioning, trying to understand your way of thinking, attitude.

So that fuel, energy, food, water sources can be run by government funded businesses? Our taxes would go up, no? Do you think the cost would be less and better service?

When PG&e was going through bankruptcy a handful of years ago after the fires the masses were saying they should be taken over and ran by the government. These same people that think its PG&Es responsibility to come on their private property and trim/cut their personal trees that havnt been maintained. Yes, you will pay one way or another for that.

Lets make everything free. That sounds better.

The huge fires up here, the Camp Fire and the Dixie Fire were caused by lack of maintenance on PG&E equipment and trees on THEIR easement falling on the power lines.
And, yes, there's a problem with private property owners letting their land become fire hazards. I have one next door and another across the street. Cal Fire is trying to do inspections and notify the owners to take action or CalFire will do it and bill them. But it takes time. PG&E is a monopoly and needs to be broken up into regional companies.

Mad

 

[Eldritch]

Won't argue... I agree the Gubment took it to a whole notha level.

Boomer Looting is funny. I am sorry you have to live through that man.

Haha, thanks, it is actually much worse for later generations than us X kids.

X is the one holding the bag right now as we are taking running everything over from the Boomers, but the multi-generational fallout from the shitty planning will probably be worse for Millennials and Z.

We have been given a nation stripped and looted to the core and mired in inescapable debt, but as the first generation taking on that once perfect and polished machine, it is still in pretty sturdy shape.

When the Millennials take over, the patch repairs and rust will have taken a much more significant toll. For example when Vallejo went bankrupt, X had already been to college, built a career, had some resiliency against the fallout.

Millennials were in their teens and 20's, just trying to get started when the related Great Recession hit and crippled their financial beginnings.

As the Silver Tsunami hits with the last of the Boomers ('64/'65) retiring in the next 5-10 years, X is going to get to be the badguy and live up to their reputation as the cold, insensitive, post apocalypse surviving, latch key kids they were raised (or not raised) to be, being the ones responsible for the bloodthristy draconian financial and safety net reforms that will be required to save the country ala Greece in 2009ish.

Millennials again may be taking the brunt of that blow as they are midstream in their EUL will probably have to make major pivots on their planning, I expect it won't be as crippling as their early days in the great recession.

The hope for recovery lies with Gen Z who will be approaching middle age at the time of reform and still have time to plan appropriately.

The Alphas, children of M & Z, will with any luck mostly grow up in a post Boomer apocalypse financial landscape, one were the U.S. is much less invested in having to play a role as world police generations after the Soviets have died and the new Asian ascension has shifted global power more to the East.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/econom...hard-by-the-covid-19-pandemic-face-bankruptcy

Interesting times.

 

[GAJ]

Millennials will get boomer inheritances, with some forecasts saying $320k or so.

Gen X will be similarly fortunate.

I didn't get a tenth of that which is fine as I wanted my parents to spend it till they dropped.

 

[Bay Arean]

I receive a pension payment from working 20 years at Rossmoor, a non-profit non-government funded housing development. They were phasing out pensions when I came to work, offering 50-50 pension, 401K and now only offer 401Ks to new employees.

I don’t know if I am Boomer looting but that monthly pension equals my entire Soc Security. The 401K portion is pathetic in terms of gain, and it would take decades to amount to much. I have to collect on it when I reach 72. I am so grateful for that pension but not sure how it hurts you younger gens. I wish everybody had pensions but I must be ignorant to understand why that’s bad.

The one thing I THINK I know is that making everyone go into 401Ks means you better play day trader (really watch the investments by category) with it or it will just lose by design to the more savvy people at the top. Pension admins are certainly corruptible but it has been their job to make that money gain not lose. I have never figured out if the 401K conversion was a more realistic and somehow fair thing to do with wage garnishments or a scam by the wealthiest to extract more money by the same means.

This last year, the non-profit board I worked for sold the remaining pension fund to an insurance outfit. So I don’t know if one day, that company will go belly-up and I will lose the pension, but I am prone to catastrophizing that it may happen. Then I will have to live on the meager 401K remainder, (plus social) so I live fairly frugally for that reason.

 

[byke]

I do think 20 years is kinda bogus. I knew a guy that was "retired" from the military, think he was something like 45'ish at the time. Nothing special, just a regular quasi-douche that drove around with gel in his hair and did nothing all day, went to the coffee shop, gym, that sort of stuff. I don't like the idea of funding that.

 

[Bay Arean]

I do think 20 years is kinda bogus. I knew a guy that was "retired" from the military, think he was something like 45'ish at the time. Nothing special, just a regular quasi-douche that drove around with gel in his hair and did nothing all day, went to the coffee shop, gym, that sort of stuff. I don't like the idea of funding that.

Yeah, I don’t see why that’s bogus. I paid the money from my check every month, I worked very hard at the job, had no union protection and could be fired at will. The pension amount is based on the formula of what I put in. I worked until I was 67 and was getting migraines more and more after staring at a computer for those 20 years. I actually had to retire, I just couldn’t function any more.

How is that bogus and how are you funding that amount? This is non-governmental so the military comparison is not apt. What am I missing? That retiring is a sin? I am the first of my generation to have ever retired in my family and I live here in the DLZ (Richmond-San Pablo) still paying a mortgage and a shitload of property tax assessments for the failing huge school district and other agencies. I can no longer have decent dental benefits despite paying for Kaiser and Medicare and fear the next crown or root canal. I will never have a fancy retirement home, a boat, hookers and blow whatever. I get it for public pensions, especially the spiking bit but how am I hurting you?