Practical tips for rapture day

[Lex Talionis]

And now for something humorous:

Those seeking the Rapture should be careful what they wish for; something like this may be at the end of the light:

Lex

 

[V4]

that's what i said earlier...

some people think the whole rapture thing is ufo coming to earth...

all i think is,

"white people.."

 

[Shotline]

"Many people believe that motorcycles are death traps. Totally preposterous belief, but so what if they believe that? It has no effect on me..."

Your head has been in a dark place if you have no knowledge of the past and proposed future legislation to curtail your enjoyment of motorcycling - for your own good, of course. And society's good in general, as motorcyclists are a "well known drag on health care costs."

Lex

I am not going to go through this again. Please go back and read my posts in this thread.

Legislation would be action.

 

[Obscura]

White People be crazy

 

[papa911]

I am not going to go through this again. Please go back and read my posts in this thread.

Legislation would be action.

Shotline- do you agree that peoples' belief in religion sometimes causes action which does have an affect on other people?

I think that's how most people are framing your question.

 

[Shotline]

I get where you are coming from now, and if we are talking about belief only, then, YES, I will agree with you, it has no effect on me notwithstanding the argument about entropy.

By reading the other folks answers to your question, it appears they didn't get your point either.

Thank you for taking the time to clarify your question.

Ok, whew, I am glad we are through that. So not that we agree that someones belief alone has no effect on others, we can return to the original (well not the original but one I think is worthy of discussion) question.

Does a persons actions, based on a belief, matter, if those actions have other (possibly better) justification?

So does it matter (if true) that George Bush invaded Iraq and Afgansitan because he believed he was on a mission from God, even though there was other valid justification (U.N and congressional authority) for the invasions?

For the purposes of this discussion we must assume that it is a fact that GW thought he was on a mission from God. I have seen/heard this alluded to in the past but never any concrete facts. We also must restrict the discussion to the facts at hand. If you disagreed with the UN and Congress on whether we should have invaded those countries that is fine. However it is a fact that it was authorized by those bodies and therefore was sufficient justification for an invasion, even if the underlying reasons for the justification were later found to be false.

 

[Shotline]

Shotline- do you agree that peoples' belief in religion sometimes causes action which does have an affect on other people?

I think that's how most people are framing your question.

I would absolutely agree with this and their actions are not always for good.

 

[Lex Talionis]

I am not going to go through this again. Please go back and read my posts in this thread.

Legislation would be action.

Go back to what I stated:

"All action, other than involuntary action such as jerking away from a hot object, is the result of belief."

Lex

 

[papa911]

Does a persons actions, based on a belief, matter, if those actions have other (possibly better) justification?

So does it matter (if true) that George Bush invaded Iraq and Afgansitan because he believed he was on a mission from God, even though there was other valid justification (U.N and congressional authority) for the invasions?

For the purposes of this discussion we must assume that it is a fact that GW thought he was on a mission from God. I have seen/heard this alluded to in the past but never any concrete facts. We also must restrict the discussion to the facts at hand. If you disagreed with the UN and Congress on whether we should have invaded those countries that is fine. However it is a fact that it was authorized by those bodies and therefore was sufficient justification for an invasion, even if the underlying reasons for the justification were later found to be false.

I wasn't a part of that conversation and what I think about it doesn't matter, but- if he invaded because he was on a mission from God and that was his only reason and he was just using the other reasons as justification, yes it matters because he misled the Nation into war.

Edit: If it was just another justification, then no it doesn't matter. He's not the only President who's admitted to being influenced by God, IIRC.



Did I answer your question?

 

[Obscura]

Headshots, they'll come back as Zombies, yo.

 

[sandyxb]

Headshots, they'll come back as Zombies, yo.

According to certain eschantology, some of the worthy dead will be resurrected for the rapture. So, you're saying that whoever shoots one of them will be responsible for the zombie apocalypse? That's cruel.

 

[papa911]

WTF- eschantology? Now I gotta go and look up another one of your words. KISS please.

Edit: Ok, that one was easy.

 

[mlm]

With my luck I'll hear about the Rapture after it already happened. Just like all those damn earthquakes people post about on BARF.

 

[Shotline]

I wasn't a part of that conversation and what I think about it doesn't matter, but- if he invaded because he was on a mission from God and that was his only reason and he was just using the other reasons as justification, yes it matters because he misled the Nation into war.

Edit: If it was just another justification, then no it doesn't matter. He's not the only President who's admitted to being influenced by God, IIRC.



Did I answer your question?

Hmm, yes you did answer it, thanks. Your comments bring up another question I will have to think about though. If someone's justification for their actions is something ridiculous to the situation, but there are better justifications that the person didn't know about, does their ridiculous justification matter? Your opinion is clear, but I need to think about this for myself.

 

[papa911]

Just read an article where the reporters talk to some of the folks spreading the word. Drives the point home that these folks BELIEVE it's going to happen and have taken drastic decisions based on this belief; spending all their savings, quitting jobs, choosing this belief over their marriages/families, etc...

As a side note: I recall now that I met a homeless guy once in Eugene, OR while travellng through around 1991-92 and spent the day with him as he talked about how he deciphered the bible and he had predicted the end of the world to be happening in, I think, 1993. I found him to be very coherent and not crazy at all even though his beliefs were out there as far as I was concerned.

We were in a park with a small river running through it and it had a pedestrian bridge that was maybe 20- 30' above. He asked me if I wanted to jump off it and I said," Sure if you go first." Went to the top and he jumped into the river which was flowing pretty good and had rocks visible. He came up, so I jumped into the same spot that he did. Everything ok.

Told that story to someone who was familiar with that park and they told me nobody jumps off that bridge. (?)

http://m.npr.org/story/136053462?url=/2011/05/07/136053462/is-the-end-nigh-well-know-soon-enough

 

[Sane_Man]

Just read an article where the reporters talk to some of the folks spreading the word. Drives the point home that these folks BELIEVE it's going to happen and have taken drastic decisions based on this belief; spending all their savings, quitting jobs, choosing this belief over their marriages/families, etc...

As a side note: I recall now that I met a homeless guy once in Eugene, OR while travellng through around 1991-92 and spent the day with him as he talked about how he deciphered the bible and he had predicted the end of the world to be happening in, I think, 1993. I found him to be very coherent and not crazy at all even though his beliefs were out there as far as I was concerned.

We were in a park with a small river running through it and it had a pedestrian bridge that was maybe 20- 30' above. He asked me if I wanted to jump off it and I said," Sure if you go first." Went to the top and he jumped into the river which was flowing pretty good and had rocks visible. He came up, so I jumped into the same spot that he did. Everything ok.

Told that story to someone who was familiar with that park and they told me nobody jumps off that bridge. (?)

http://m.npr.org/story/136053462?url=/2011/05/07/136053462/is-the-end-nigh-well-know-soon-enough

Blows my mind that people put all their faith and base their life decisions on what's printed in that book, while not really thinking about who actually put in the content.

If you own a business that you close, and fire all your employees in advance of May 21st, that really affects other peoples lives based on your beliefs. If the world is ending or whatever, what do you gain by spending your savings and quitting your job before that date?

 

[ILOAD2]

However it is a fact that it was authorized by those bodies and therefore was sufficient justification for an invasion, even if the underlying reasons for the justification were later found to be false.[/i]

I just had to jump in here real quick for some clarification on you're "take" on what the FACTS are....


There is a HUGE difference between "later found to be false" and KNOWING the information you are putting forward is a complete LIE. The President and The Vice President knew before authorization was given from the two body's you mentioned that there where No weapons of mass destruction.

Let's keep it real here-mm K..

 

[OldMadBrit]

It may sound preposterous and it may even be absolutely preposterous.......but so what? Many people believe that motorcycles are death traps. Totally preposterous belief, but so what if they believe that? It has no effect on me, I know what I know and what you think you know means nothing to me.

So, if someone says they believe in God, so what? You know what you know so how does what they believe effect you?

I think you are missing the point that others are making.

I am a "recovering Christian" slowly working through the BS that I was brainwashed with as a kid. I have no problem with believers believeing what they want - in their own space on their on dime.

What really gets me are:

1) Bible thumping, idiots who shove their beliefs in your face, whether by knocking on the door of your home, erecitng stupid and offensive signs, or irritating the crap out of me over a megaphone, while I'm waiting to enter a music venue.

2) Any aspect of "the man in the sky" entering the realm of public policy, whether its gay rights, abortion rights, the right to have multiple wives yada yada yada.

Given the horrors of persicution that non-belivers have suffered for 1,000's of years at the hands of the "TRUE BELIEVERS" I think believers should cut us some slack when we poke fun.

 

[Shotline]

I think you are missing the point that others are making.

I am a "recovering Christian" slowly working through the BS that I was brainwashed with as a kid. I have no problem with believers believeing what they want - in their own space on their on dime.

What really gets me are:

1) Bible thumping, idiots who shove their beliefs in your face, whether by knocking on the door of your home, erecitng stupid and offensive signs, or irritating the crap out of me over a megaphone, while I'm waiting to enter a music venue.

2) Any aspect of "the man in the sky" entering the realm of public policy, whether its gay rights, abortion rights, the right to have multiple wives yada yada yada.

Given the horrors of persicution that non-belivers have suffered for 1,000's of years at the hands of the "TRUE BELIEVERS" I think believers should cut us some slack when we poke fun.

Oh no, I absolutely understand with what people think which basically boils down to prejudice. If a person believes a certain way they will act a certain way. However it is my contention that belief and action are not dependent. For instance, you list gay rights, abortion rights and multiple wives. Most religions have positions against these things based on their religious beliefs and people who are for these things automatically assume that if someone is against them it is based on flawed religious beliefs. I contend however that there are very valid reasons (others won't agree of course) that someone could be against these things without being religious or having any belief in any god.

 

[papa911]

Oh no, I absolutely understand with what people think which basically boils down to prejudice. If a person believes a certain way they will act a certain way. However it is my contention that belief and action are not dependent. For instance, you list gay rights, abortion rights and multiple wives. Most religions have positions against these things based on their religious beliefs and people who are for these things automatically assume that if someone is against them it is based on flawed religious beliefs. I contend however that there are very valid reasons (others won't agree of course) that someone could be against these things without being religious or having any belief in any god.

I haven't heard anyone say that religion is the ONLY reason that people take sides on issues. Have you?